Last month, a Virginia Tech student was found dead in the Target parking lot of the Christiansburg, Virginia store with a self-inflicted gunshot to the head. His name was Daniel Kim, a 21-year old senior at the university. Unfortunately, some individuals have already started making assumptions that somehow his death was related to and possibly caused by gaming.
After doing a little research, I discovered that gaming is actually the one thing in his life that gave him a chance to live. Daniel was an avid Warcraft player who had developed numerous friendships playing the game over the past couple of years. The only warning signs that he was on the edge came in the form of emails sent to the university from various WoW players who were concerned for his safety. Unfortunately, little action was taken from the warnings and as we all know, Daniel Kim is now dead.
This was an unfortunate and probably preventable tragedy. It’s also unfortunate that some people will try to blame games when gaming may have been the only positive thing going on in his life. Online multiplayer games have a social aspect that the media simply does not understand. You create bonds with people you have never seen in real life. When it’s the middle of the night and there’s no one to talk to in person, there’s always a gamer somewhere online who will talk. When things are heavy on my mind, I often fire up the Xbox 360 and play some “big team battle” with my Halo 3 friends. I’ve never met any of them in real life, but I consider them true friends. I think one of the major problems with the media right now is that they simply do not see the overall kindness and generosity most gamers have in their hearts. As gamers, we do talk a lot of smack, but that’s honestly part of the fun. In the end, I truly believe that most hard-core gamers are good people with kind natures.
To be honest, I can’t objectively tackle the subject of video games and Virginia Tech at the same time. I was enraged that people such as Jack Thompson blamed the April 16 massacre on gaming when I was there and I saw what happened. I lost a good friend that day and I suppose that makes me take these media attacks personally. When you see large collections of lifeless bodies lying in pools of blood, you just don’t think of what to blame. There are more important issues at hand. Perhaps the media is simply too far detached from the reality of life to understand these tragedies. It did not surprise me that some people are voicing their opinions that gaming was somehow behind this recent suicide in the Hokie community.
Daniel Kim was an avid World of Warcraft player. He didn’t leave much behind in life. The only clues come from the traces of information from his instant messenger and Warcraft files. He left a cell phone behind with many numbers in them, but no one really knows what happened. I’m sure he’ll be missed by his WoW comrades. It was great that some of his Warcraft friends made attempts to contact the university asking for someone to help him. I think this situation shows how video game communities often care about each other more than we realize. It’s just a shame no one followed up on the emails the way they should have.
216 Comments to Virginia Tech, Suicide And World Of Warcraft
by: weclock
On January 24, 2008 at 4:08 am
you know who I blame for articles like these?
video games.
We’d never have articles in defense of video games, if there weren’t any video games.
also, yaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay.
by: William
On January 24, 2008 at 4:45 am
yeah I guess that’s right. It really sucks that we have to defend video games, but it’s all part of the media game. I think the gaming media really needs to voice their opinions on the subject whenever possible. I really have no clue what the right answers are.. the media battle that takes place over almost every subject gets old after a while, but it has to be talked about.
by: Jack Thompson, Attorney
On January 24, 2008 at 5:51 am
In fact, Cho, according to the Washington Post, was an obsessive player of Counter-Strike in high school. The effects of these games are LONG-TERM, not just short-term, as the scientific evidence proves.
Also, the hard drive of Cho’s computer was never found, so you have no earthly basis for which to say that he didn’t continue to play violent games. None. His suite mates had no idea he had weapons in his room, either.
So you can be as enraged as you want about the link between violent video games and what Cho and others like him have done. Go rage at a full moon as well, convinced that it is Satan’s orb to raise the seas.
Next time, before you post such a silly set of assertions, actually read the medical, scientific, and law enforcement research. It establishes, irrefutably, the causal link between violent games and acts of violence.
So sue me. Jack Thompson
by: William
On January 24, 2008 at 7:39 am
The link between violent games and acts of violence is extremely casual at best. The entire argument around gaming causes violence is pointless. The argument more or less is one that completely removes individual accountability from the factors. And believe me, I know more about the VT investigation than most of the public. I have also researched the topic to a great extent. There is not one single valid scientific study linking playing violent games to acts of violence.
When it comes to individuals who commit horrible crimes like Cho did, there are hundreds of factors that helped push him over the edge. His family life, his mental illnesses and social factors had the biggest impact. If you want to talk about media influencing him, you can mention the Columbine coverage as a very big factor in his decisions, so are you going to blame the news for covering news?
The Washington Post articles on Cho are mostly misinformed. I was actually shocked at how off the press was with this entire event. The misinformation flying around was astounding.
To blame gaming for violence is like trying to blame cars for drunk driving. It makes no sense.
by: William
On January 24, 2008 at 7:45 am
You really can’t base information on news reports fully these days anyway. I recall on the evening of April 16th when I finally got back to my apartment, numerous news shows were reporting that there was more than one shooter.
You really can’t trust the news these days. You have to go to numerous sources and sort out the facts.
To be honest, at this point there really haven’t been enough in-depth reports on this subject to claim that your point is valid. The few studies that have been done are extremely casual and not scientific.
Acts of violence tend to be brought on by dozens and hundreds of factors and games are not even close to being on the top half of the list.
by: Anonymous Coward
On January 24, 2008 at 10:02 am
Can someone provide links to these misleading press articles? I’ve never heard of the gaming connection with Kim until just now. (I heard he made friends through WoW, but nothing as stupid as a connection to the suicide.)
And, William, I remember the same thing from April 16; but it was the POLICE that were saying there may be more than one shooter.
by: William
On January 24, 2008 at 10:45 am
the police never said that. It’s standard procedure for police to sweep for a second shooter whether there is one or not. The press just ran with misinformation.
by: Jack Thompson, Attorney
On January 24, 2008 at 11:44 am
Dear Neanderthals: The American Psychological Association has established a direct causal link between violent video games and aggression. What is your counter source, a Ouia Board?
Cho’s high school classmates said he was totally into Counter-Strike. Again, what is your counter source, his ghost? Grow up.
by: William
On January 24, 2008 at 12:12 pm
The APA has not established a direct casual link between violent video games and aggression. Their findings were a correlation link, not casual. Go back to high school science class and re-learn some things.
There is a huge difference between correlation and casual.
by: William
On January 24, 2008 at 12:27 pm
Causal basically means that one thing caused another. That has never and will never be established. There is a relatively minor correlation between video games and violence, but it’s at the tail end of a very long list of things.
by: Jack Thompson, Attorney
On January 24, 2008 at 12:42 pm
I’m the “moron?” GamePolitics, which was lying about the APA’s only establishing a correlation, not causation, contacted the experts on the Commission that issued the report, and they confirmed that the link established was (are you ready?) “causal.” Honestly, if you gamers can’t read, then put down the controllers, step away from the game platforms, go back to school, and get a real education. The link established is causal, not correlationial.
Duh…
by: Ron Whitaker
On January 24, 2008 at 1:04 pm
For every study that one side cites, there is another study that directly refutes it. There has been no proof of causality, only theoretical ‘connections.’ I doubt we’ll ever see a study that can definitively provide the answer one way or another.
Citing studies as your sole source of proof isn’t enough. I can commission a study that shows that everyone in the state of California would prefer to be turned into an eggplant, but that doesn’t make it fact.
by: Smockmanzero
On January 24, 2008 at 1:23 pm
It’s human nature for someone to look at something they think is horrible and make a imaginary link between that thing and something else horrible. Everything that we know so far about violence and violent video games are assumptions.
@Fake Jack Thompson it is also human nature to hide behind the guise of a more known entity. You are not Jack Thompson a real lawyer would not call his opposition Neanderthals and say duh.. to make a point. But i guess Jack Thompson is not a good lawyer.
by: Y2K (AKA Milenium bug)
On January 24, 2008 at 2:21 pm
i truly doubt the REAL Jack Thompson would appear here, but if you are, sir you are a real jackass who like most lawyers in this crooked world was trained to talk out his own ass!
by: Ldysabella
On January 24, 2008 at 2:41 pm
Come on people! Don’t feed the Troll anymore!
by: somewhat
On January 24, 2008 at 2:53 pm
Sadly, the true Thompson has been known to communicate via this site, and read it. And ‘bella’s advice is the best I’ve read in a while. LOL !
by: ManOfTeal
On January 24, 2008 at 4:27 pm
I like pie
by: Jack Thompson, Attorney
On January 24, 2008 at 4:45 pm
Immediate News Release – January 24, 2008
Grand Theft Auto IV to Be Released April 29; Culture War Begins Now
The sociopaths who run Take-Two Interactive Software, Inc., announced today that their Grand Theft Auto IV video game will be released April 29, 2008.
Take-Two shares have jumped approximately 12% today on this news. What the market is not factoring in, however, is the downside risk coming Take-Two’s way with the sale of this “Mature” game to kids, which is a murder simulator for violence against women, cops, and innocent bystanders. Brain scan studies at Harvard, Indiana, and Michigan State Universities prove kids process these games in a different part of the brain than do adults, and this neurobiological differential leads to copycatting behaviors, as the American Psychological Association found in 2005.
The Federal Trade Commission and private groups have found that roughly 50% of the time Mature-rated games are sold to kids of all ages who want to buy them with no parent in sight in brick and mortar stores. Indeed Best Buy, Wal-Mart, GameStop, and even Toys R Us are this very day all selling Grand Theft Auto IV via the Internet to anyone of any age with no age verification whatsoever prior to its April 29 ship date.
Take-Two is in fact pre-selling Grand Theft Auto IV directly at its own web site today with no age verification to anyone of any age, despite what will be the game’s “Mature” rating.
Miami attorney and anti-violent video game activist Jack Thompson will, in the days and weeks ahead, be contacting state and federal officials to stop the improper sales of Grand Theft Auto IV to anyone under seventeen years of age, as any such sales violate state and federal fraudulent and deceptive trade practices statutes. Indeed, Thompson has today contacted Florida Attorney General Bill McCollum, who has supported Thompson’s efforts in the past.
by: Nobody
On January 24, 2008 at 5:32 pm
Dude, please.
The amount of shit going on in the world that we can see and hear in the media, the amount of shit we can read in the papers and talk about with others, the amount of shit we experience as kids and adolescents is the root of evil. Dont just forget that and say “oh yeah, he played games. that is what killed him”.
It so short sighted to say such things and then expect others to accept and respect your opinion. The fact that you are a lawyer is even more of a concern, it means we live in a world where everyone can become everything without even being able to think logicaly for himself.
It’s pure ignorant of you to place a blame onto something you actually dont know, simply because the subject you’re talking about died with the person involved. If you didn’t speak with the case subject and debate the issue on all levels, than your opinion is biased at its best.
So, please, accept the hint the other poster said. Go back to school.
Thank you.
by: mooshimooshi
On January 24, 2008 at 6:06 pm
in FPS games when i am about to end a playing session i do about 5 suicides for kicks. like in oblivion i’ll kill everyone and aggro every guard there is, or in half life 2 i’ll jump off a cliff in front of alyx (OMG that’s so mean!).
but ah, i will never ever ever ever EVER off myself. video games don’t make me want to replicate what i’m doing in the virtual world. this is the real world. and there are real consequences. why can’t these damn conservatives leave people alone? if i ever become a billionaire, i’ll buy several islands for them to live on, far, far away from society. wouldn’t that be nice?
by: Duddee
On January 24, 2008 at 6:18 pm
Wow. I love how ppl look at video games and see like cod4, OMG HE SHOT A GUY. get over it you know how many gamers there are and how many so called “related” deaths there are? That number is probably lower than many issues, how many drinkers and deaths are there, if u wana say video games are making violence and should be taken care of you are a freaking idiot. Look around you and stop pointing fingers at something that like many of us said, making assumptions and false statements about. We all have played CS or wow, are we now murderers and beat up old ppl? But now were frowned upon by the media cause were gamers and were so dangerous cause were now violent. Games dont bring on violence, if ur parrents beat u when u were little then ur going to be screwed up the rest of ur life. IF you play games later in life and then kill someone after being beaten, what does the finger get pointed at? I mean really its blantly obvious that games are entertainment and those who take them serious, are either biased or have mental illnesses.
by: Jack Thompson, Attorney
On January 24, 2008 at 6:32 pm
As soon as one of you gets a Ph.D. in psychology and does a longitudinal study to rebut what the APA, the largest association of psychologists in the world found about the causal link between violent games and agression, let me know.
You e-tards here have gone from saying “There is no APA study” to saying “Oh, we don’t agree with it.” Make up your mind. And in the meantime, put down the games and do your homework. You might actually learn something useful instead of wasting your lives on games. How sad. Jack Thompson (I do know Jack and you don’t)
by: Iku Tri
On January 24, 2008 at 7:35 pm
Are you really him or just some stupid fuck?
E-tards? Really? Bad choice of words……let the flames begin……
And if you are not him, you do a great impression of the ignorant fool…..
by: DPK
On January 24, 2008 at 7:40 pm
Wow, this Jack Thompson troll is really a dick!
So I assume he’s just a plant by the website to get conversation going right? No one could inadvertantly be that much of a cock bag. Excepting Ann Coulter of course.
by: Duddee
On January 24, 2008 at 8:11 pm
We need to do our homework and get a phd? Yo dickhead, why dont u get ur mind out of ur own ass cause thats where it seems to be. Why dont u actually pick up a game and play it and then tell us it makes u want to hurt someone. IT DOESNT. Go back in ur think tank u dumbass
by: Shawn Sines
On January 24, 2008 at 8:22 pm
DPK, no he’s not a plant.. he’s real.. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jack_Thompson_(attorney)
by: William
On January 24, 2008 at 9:06 pm
the APA also has well-known studies implying that children are more aggressive after watching Sesame Street.
This so called cultural war against violent video games is nil. We do live in America and do not need the government regulating us any heavier than they already do. I firmly believe in keeping violent games away from young children, but it’s mostly adults playing. If kids are playing, it’s because their parents are buying it for them. That’s not our problem and shouldn’t be an industry problem. That’s a parenting issue.
by: Daniel
On January 24, 2008 at 9:17 pm
@DPK: Wow, that’s a great idea. I wish we were witty enough to plant our own Jack Thompson, but as Shawn said, he is the real Jack Thompson
by: William
On January 24, 2008 at 9:20 pm
Also, I’m not sure if you have been to a GameStop, Wal-Mart or Target (the 3 places I tend to buy games) but when they scan M rated games, they are instructed to warn you that the game is rated M, etc. And they will not sell the game to children. I think the rating system we have is fine. If parents are going to buy it for their kids anyway, shouldn’t that be an issue with them and not with the rest of the responsible gaming world?
by: The Man
On January 24, 2008 at 9:42 pm
Jack Thompson is a fucking dickhead and needs to either learn about what he attacks, or go die in a hole.
by: MasterChief14
On January 24, 2008 at 10:00 pm
Kind of funny Jack says don’t waste your time on video games when he clearly wastes his time with obstreperously asinine comments. I also fail to see why you are on this site, when you are a crusader against these video games. Either you seek attention for the hell hole you come secluded to, or just are just undoubtedly stubborn. How about you drop the mouse and make better use of your time. (e-tard, how silly.)
by: Kirby
On January 24, 2008 at 10:42 pm
I never understood what’s Jack’s position is….does he want to prevent children from buying M-rated games, or ban M-rated games altogether?
To be honest, I’m all for keeping kids away from buying M-rated games, but to treat us all like unstable-minded people who can’t tell the difference between reality and fantasy, I have a BIG problem with that.
by: weclock
On January 24, 2008 at 10:49 pm
I just wish people would look at World of Warcraft and go “OMG HE STABBED A GUY!” (which by the way, is a far more violent crime than shooting..).
It’s the only game, in which I wish there was a real large boycott of, because it has been (by misuse of it’s users) a life destroying force for many people.
Perhaps video games, in some instances can cause violence, because if I had access to the WoW servers, I’d destroy them.
by: William
On January 24, 2008 at 11:10 pm
Kirby, his position is certainly confusing at times. Most of the conservative rights who are strongly against video games and other forms of media tend to use children as the excuse to go against things. It’s fairly well known that a majority of gamers are males in their mid to late 20s so I’m not sure how gaming is even an issue about kids. There are always cases of parents who purchase adult themed games and movies for their kids, but that really isn’t something we can control. Bad parenting is bad parenting.
There were mass shootings and violence long before games were invented. This is just an old debate that shifts it’s focus onto whatever the new hot topic is. It went from comic books to radio to movies to television and now the emphasis is on gaming.
by: somewhat
On January 25, 2008 at 1:11 am
So does thompson have a doctorate also ? Because if I need one to know that the games I’m playing are turning me into a savage killer, wouldn’t he need one to know that he’s not doing a very good job as a lawyer attacking law abiding citizens (gamers)? And who deemed the people at Take-Two as being sociopathic ? Thompson ? A friend of his ? The guy down the street ? You would think a lawyer would be wary of slandering people in a news release. This does nothing to instill a feeling of trust and credibility towards you jack. M games to kids isn’t right, but neither is attacking a community for the legal passtime it partakes in.
by: goon165
On January 25, 2008 at 2:34 am
ok let’s end this jack Thompson Bull Shit.
he’s just trying to make a name for himself by using all this Anti-Video Games crap to get himself on the news, internet and any other form of information viewed by the public.
really the guys just trying to feed the Super massive Black Hole of an ego he has
just take heart in knowing that all the people like jack who didn’t grow up with video games and who don’t understand them and think there a threat are on there way out. and soon people like us, the gamers will be in the seats of power and all of this “games teach people to kill” nonsense will be gone. i believe that day is close at hand my friends so just wait.
our time will come.
goon165, Gamer for life
by: Jack Thompson, Attorney
On January 25, 2008 at 4:53 am
Dear Goon165:
First of all, nice name. It says it all.
Secondly, nobody, and I mean nobody, takes seriously nor should they take seriously, a bunch of cowards who rant and rave about this or any issue anonymously. The signers of the Declaration of Independence had the courage to put their names on the document. I use my name. You e-tards hide behind avatars because you are cowards, and cowards change nothing but their underwear.
As to my not knowing anything about video games because I have not played them: I have played them. And anyone with a brain and a moral compass is appalled by the sale of GTA to ten-year-olds.
That is my issue, because neurology proves that such young brains are more easily molded into more violence-disposed brains. If you can’t understand and won’t understand that, then the retardation induced by the games is obviously patent. You’re then Exhibit A.
Jack Thompson
by: Jack Thompson, Attorney
On January 25, 2008 at 6:18 am
John B. Thompson, Attorney at Law
1172 S. Dixie Hwy., Suite 111
Coral Gables, Florida 33146
January 25, 2008
Bill Gates, Chairman
Microsoft Corporation
Redmond, Oregon Via Fax to (425) 93-MSFAX (936-7329)
Re: Full Corporate Responsibility
Dear Mr. Gates:
I have read with great interest your speech yesterday to the World Economic Forum in Davos, Switzerland: http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/economics/wef/article3248455.ece .
As a Christian, I applaud your and your wife’s long-standing adherence to the Biblical imperative to provide for the poor.
Allow me to note another Biblical imperative from the mouth of Jesus Christ:
“If any of you should cause one of these little ones to stumble, then it would be better for you that a millstone be tied around your neck and that you be cast into the uttermost depths of the sea.”
Microsoft Corporation participates actively in the practice of marketing and selling “Mature” video games to kids under 17 years of age in the United States. Right this moment, Best Buy, Wal-Mart, GameStop, and even Toys R Us are selling your company’s Mature-rated Microsoft XBox 360 games at their Internet web sites to kids of all ages with no age verification whatsoever. Further, the United States Federal Trade Commission has proven that Mature games, including XBox 360 games, are being sold roughly half the time to kids of all ages in brick-and-mortar retail store chains across the United States.
Microsoft is a member of the Entertainment Software Association, which aggressively lobbies and litigates for your company’s alleged “right” to sell ESRB-rated “Mature” games directly to children with no parents involved in the transactions. This sleight of hand by which your company says it supports age restrictions on the sale of Mature games while at the same time flouting the age ID system, constitutes, in my and others’ legal opinion, a clear violation of state and federal “fraudulent and deceptive trade practice” statutes. I have alerted certain law enforcement officials to this fact.
At http://www.microsoft.com, you and your company proclaim your Corporate Responsibility:
“As an industry leader and the world’s largest software company, Microsoft has a responsibility to act as a good corporate citizen in every country around the world. Whether it is complying with local laws and regulations, demonstrating ethical business standards, mitigating risks to the environment, or protecting human rights, Microsoft is committed to being a global leader in corporate social responsibility. [emphases added]
Using your own above words, Microsoft has an obligation to be a good corporate citizen “in every country,” and that includes in the United States where an ESRB age game rating is supposed to mean something. “Complying with local laws” includes fraudulent and deceptive trade practices statutes that prohibit companies from saying one thing and then doing quite another in the marketing of their products. One of the “risks to the environment” includes the celebration of violence and misogyny in our pop culture environment that glamorizes killing cops, beating women, and killing innocent bystanders just for the fun of it. There can be pollution of kids’ minds as well as pollution of their water and air. “Columbine” is not just a school. Finally, one “human right” is the right of a parent not to have corporations, including yours, marketing and selling adult products to their kids behind their backs.
Why is all this important, as a matter of public health and safety, that Microsoft stop participating in the marketing and sale of adult video games to children? Because hard science—brain scan studies at Harvard, Indiana, and Michigan State Universities—shows that kids process violent games in the parts of the brain that lead to copycatting behaviors. This neurobiological differential between teen and adult brains is what undergirds, scientifically, the video game age-rating system that your own industry and your company routinely violate.
With great respect for all you have done for others but with an eye toward what you can and must yet do, I implore you, as Microsoft’s Chairman, to tell the video game industry that Microsoft will henceforth not tolerate industry practices that result in the sale of “Mature” XBox games to American kids under seventeen years of age. You can impose this stricture with the stroke of a pen. Any company that violates this stricture will be denied your products. This is not censorship. This is voluntary corporate responsibility.
Finally, I would humbly suggest that you cannot credibly fund international charity with corporate profits secured by harming children here at home.
Corporate responsibility, like charity, begins at home.
Regards, Jack Thompson
Copies: Media, others
by: MasterChief14
On January 25, 2008 at 6:55 am
What ever happened to parents being parents, it sounds like you want the government to change our diapers and feed us with a spoon. Hence the stores should follow the law on not selling mature games to minors, but it’s parents fault for not confiscating the game from the child if he did somehow bought or received a mature rated game. Also for your unnecessary avatar comment is the fact it’s common sense not to use your real name everywhere on the internet, I don’t think I have to explain to you why either.
by: 0rpheus
On January 25, 2008 at 7:40 am
Pft, those no-life nerds, I pity them. Get a life and stop killing yourselves!!!
by: Jack Thompson, Attorney
On January 25, 2008 at 8:30 am
Re parents being parents: Pay attention: The whole issue is whether stores should sell Mature games to kids when their parents are not there! I have a fifteen year old. I would be very upset if Best Buy sold GTA to my son without me there. Deal with it. That is the issue, not your silly fake issue of parental responsibility. We’re talking about corporate responsibility.
by: The bad guy
On January 25, 2008 at 9:42 am
I applaud Jack Thompson, unlike FOX broadcasting he has hard facts and has an good understanding of what take place in these games. I also agree with the fact that games like manhunt, grand thief auto, counter-strike, and even halo should not be sold to minors at least without their parents presence. Corporations who profit off violent video games like manhunt, grand thief auto, counter-strike, and even halo, should take responsibility and require an ID check on games being sold to minors.
Now before any of you judge my opinion understand I am 21 years old, I have a 7 year old little brother who visits me on a semi-regular basis. I would not under any circumstance allow him to play Manhunt for example while under my watch. Manhunt is about “Snuff” films, films of people dieing for the sexual or otherwise pleasure of sick human beings, that alone is just cause for my little brother not to play that game. I’m sure put into my situation any of you with a moral state of mind would do the same. (Also for the record I do not own manhunt, but found it a good example due to the extremeness of the content counter-strike and halo would also be fine examples for other reasons.) Am I the bad guy for doing this?
Jack Thompson is right in his effort to stop the sales of these games to minors who don’t have the parental or otherwise protection from these types of games. Yes I think it should be the parents responsibility but time and time again we are shown that they do not pay attention to the games their children play, I’ve played with countless underage players on Gears of war alone and Gears of war is a fairly graphic game.
regards,
The Bad guy
by: Shawn Sines
On January 25, 2008 at 10:06 am
Mr. Thompson,
I agree with your concerns regarding corporate responsibility but is regulation of commerce the only aspect of this fight you want to engage in? For this argument – against the exposure of young gamers to mature subject and content – to succeed you surely must see that it necessitates a two pronged attack. Have these games made harmful impressions on people who did not have the skills (regardless of physical age) to cope with the content and stimulation? Certainly. Reason says that is likely the case. Do the majority of consumers favor censorship of this content? Likely not as the market’s growth and positive sales trends say that the majority of buyers for games are not children, they tend to by young adults (male and female increasingly) who are turning to games of all sorts with the same love that past generations have embraced literature, radio and television as their entertainment form of choice. Are blind attacks against corporations and demands of censorship in keeping with the foundations of American liberty? Will demanding the sales of “objectionable” games not happen because the content could potentially be viewed or played by those inappropriate audiences? I’m not so sure.
Corporate education is a necessary step toward protecting our impressionable youth, and I won’t speak to the outlying societal issues related to other media here, but without parents involved and informed and doing their jobs to educate and direct their children this issue can not practically be resolved. Maybe companies have a responsibility to help parents make good decisions in their purchasing from a societal respect and maybe they have not done enough so far but I see that trend changing because of people like yourself who are crusading to make people aware that games are not strictly childs play.
However, you seem to be (and pardon me if I’m mischaracterizing your position here) placing all the imputus on the creators and vendors of these titles. The fact remains the consumers are also an issue and so long as we exist in a free market society where consumers can choose which products to buy, and continue to support products like these with their money then I dare say the market will provide them, possibly rightly so.
I think in your passion for your cause you may have mixed two very different goals together and diluted your results. You seek to protect our youth. I completely support that, but you also seem to attack those who enjoy the entertainment provided by these games, the general consumer, for supporting products containing content you disagree with – and I’m referring to those who should be allowed by the standards of our society to enjoy them.
I see so many parallels here between this and the Comic Book Code Authority movement in the 50′s and the anti-rock-n-roll movement as well. This is a new entertainment form within our society and we have to find a level at which we can ensure the basic freedoms of the consumer while defending those society decides are not yet ready to be exposed to it.
I know you are walking into a lion’s den every time you post on a forum like this or do an interview with an audience that are staunchly pro-games. I respect that you don’t expect to be heard fairly or reasonably by some members of these game communities but I think you’d find that many of us agree with your principal argument (if I got it right), just maybe not your approach or your methods.
by: Jack Thompson, Attorney
On January 25, 2008 at 10:51 am
A recent poll done by the ESA itself, which was inadvertently released to the public, found that 65% of the American people want the federal government to criminalize the sale of mature video games minors.
I have won the fight for the hearts of the American people, and your side has lost.
by: William
On January 25, 2008 at 11:30 am
It’s extremely rare for a store to sell a MA game to a minor. When it happens, the store should be brought up on charges. The kids who are playing the MA games have someone of legal age purchase them, and that’s not really something that can be taken care of easily unless you want police departments to set up sting operations in every little town and honestly the police have bigger things to worry about.
It’s kind of like beer and cigarettes. There will always be a few adults who purchase those items for kids, but you can’t punish the rest of us for the deeds of a few derelicts.
I agree with Shawn’s comment about the fact that it’s not right to attack the typical consumer. I’m all for keeping MA products out of the hands of kids, but regulation simply will not solve the problem. The games are already rated.
JT, I have no problem with criminalizing the sale of MA material to minors. I actually support that myself, but I do not support the notion that video games cause violence.
by: Ron Whitaker
On January 25, 2008 at 12:00 pm
Criminalizing the sale of ‘M’ rated video games to minors is an unnecessary interference by the government in the free market. As Shawn said, there IS a market for these games, and therefore they will continue to be made. We all know that retailers are doing an increasingly better job of regulating the sale of these games; however, the onus is not on the retailer.
The vast majority of ‘M’ rated games that end up in the hands of minors are purchased for them by their parents. The same is also true of ‘R’ rated movies, the big screen counterpart to the Mature rated game. Why is this the case? Simple. Many parents today are not aware of the content of these game,s because they simply don’t play games, or don’t follow them that closely.
When little Johnny comes home and tells his mom he wants a new game, in many cases she’ll go buy it for him. After all, the Playstation (or XBox) is a great babysitter. Then, once Mom sees the content of the game she’s bought (think Manhunt) she’s outraged, and wants someone to blame. The unfortunate truth is that she can’t see that the only blame in this situation rests squarely on her own shoulders.
Luckily, retailers (at least game specific retailers) are learning this, and are encouraging their employees to point out ratings and what they mean to parents purchasing games. That’s the beauty of a free market – it regulates itself. Don’t we have better things for our tax dollars to be used for than to help prop up the ego of a parent that made a bad decision? I think we do.
by: Jack Thompson, Attorney
On January 25, 2008 at 12:37 pm
Tell your libertarian fantasies to Ron Paul while you’re both high on marijuana.
by: Daniel
On January 25, 2008 at 12:47 pm
@Jack: Is that really your rebuttal Mr. Thompson? No wonder Judges don’t take you serious. If you want to discuss topics of Mature games, then I would at least expect you to act like an adult who can handle mature topics.
BTW: Marijuana is an illegal substance. So for you to condone the use of an illegal substance really makes me question your credibility sir.
by: Jack Thompson, Attorney
On January 25, 2008 at 12:49 pm
Dear Moron: Of course it’s an illegal substance. Adult entertainment material sold to minors is done so illegally as well. That’s he point, e-tard, which is why libertarians like you are irrelevant.
by: Fremder
On January 25, 2008 at 1:13 pm
Jack, why are you on this site about gaming and bashing Take-Two? I thought the lawsuit brought against you by Take-Two makes you unable to insult or try to discourage people from buying their products? Right there in your post about Take-Two, you call the people who work there sociopaths, what’s that for? They have done nothing to be called sociopaths, the people who work there have no choice to work on the game they are assigned to work on. Though the question I would like you to answer is why Grand Theft Auto? Out of all the games that are out right now why this one particular game?
Also you should answer quickly because 6 news posts from now and this topic will not be on the front page, how about you create a forum thread to continue this discussion?
by: Rick
On January 25, 2008 at 1:14 pm
You are really, really a huge dick. Which leads me to believe you MUST have a very small one. What the hell is your problem? Minors don’t get hold of games. They don’t. They don’t. THEY DON’T. So why are you still hanging around? GTFO.
by: Rick
On January 25, 2008 at 1:28 pm
Besides, you don’t care what anyone says, you have your (ridiculous) opinion, your idiotic crusade, and you don’t listen to a damn thing anyone else says. WHY ARE YOU HERE? You’re going to lose. Gaming is NOT going anywhere.
by: weclock
On January 25, 2008 at 1:29 pm
obvious troll is obvious.
by: goon165
On January 25, 2008 at 1:55 pm
couldn’t have said it better myself rick
by: Ryan Smiley (Kirby)
On January 25, 2008 at 3:48 pm
RON PAUL /b/!!!!!!
but seriously speaking now….why would anyone of you get offended about any of this if you are over 18? All that Jack is trying to do is prevent minors from buying M-rated games behind mommy and daddy’s back. And besides, we all know how annoying teens are in VoIP-enabled multiplayer games
This could be a good thing for the gaming industry.
It’s a fact of life now that parents don’t want to be parents anymore. When parents don’t do shit anymore, government needs to step in and do the “parenting” work instead. It sucks indeed, but without any intervention, who the hell knows what these teeny-boppers will be doing.
by: MasterChief14
On January 25, 2008 at 3:50 pm
Re parents being parents: Pay attention: The whole issue is whether stores should sell Mature games to kids when their parents are not there! I have a fifteen year old. I would be very upset if Best Buy sold GTA to my son without me there. Deal with it. That is the issue, not your silly fake issue of parental responsibility. We’re talking about corporate responsibility.
Evidently you did not read the rest of my comment, please read the rest of my comment; and focus more on the issue, not bashing people thanks.
Dear Moron: Of course it’s an illegal substance. Adult entertainment material sold to minors is done so illegally as well. That’s he point, e-tard, which is why libertarians like you are irrelevant.
Actually you are encouraging to take an illegal substance, I don’t think corporations say minors should buy mature rated games; You really place things out of context. If you are in fact a lawyer, this is a sad display of your behavior. Then again I don’t even know why I should waste a Milli second replying to you since you are the common internet troll.
by: Tim
On January 25, 2008 at 4:22 pm
I’d just like to put it out there, for all that research on video games make people violent-
I’ve watched and play the original Doom since I WAS SIX YEARS OLD
I’ve played and seen just about every violent game out there, including Grand Theft Series, Call of Duty, Quake, Half-life, too many to list.
I’m 18 now and I’ve never been in a fight, never shot anyone, never hurt anyone, I have a completly clean record….
Not exactly sure where all this violence stuff is coming from, but I can say that video games have never influenced me, I don’t care what any “expert” says.
To Parents who “want games to be rated”
DO RESEARCH MY PARENTS DID IT. IT IS POSSIBLE. Stop being lazy, you signed up for the job when you conceived, we live in a modern world, STOP BLAMING OTHER PEOPLE FOR YOUR MISTAKES.
I couldn’t agree more with the author of this article, nice job it was a great read!
by: Alex Berger
On January 25, 2008 at 5:06 pm
As a long time (8 year) guild leader i’ve dealt with a number of suicidal individuals. Luckily during their time with the guild we never lost any. How they’re doing now? I unfortunatly can’t tell you. The reality is that there are a lot of unhappy people in the world. The great thing about gaming is that it provides a safe(r) environment for them to reach out, seek help and expand their social network.
I recently did my thesis on video games influence on the “real” world. While I didn’t talk about suicide i did get into a lot of the amazing benefits which no one touches on. Instead of going on about it here, i’ll just post it as it includes a lot of what i’d regurgitate here.
http://www.alex-berger.net/Not%20Just%20A%20Game%20-%20Thesis.pdf
by: Jay Vee
On January 25, 2008 at 5:20 pm
Did he drop any good loot?
by: Jeremy
On January 25, 2008 at 5:25 pm
I played counter-strike since beta 4. If anyone know how long that is, then you can have something to say. I use to play almost 6-10 hours a day, every day if not more when I was growing up. I still play on and off but nowadays i mostly play wow, and spend time with the wife. I have a ton of friends that all played as well.
None of us have ever committed felonies, or misdemeanors or have had to spend any time in jail. A person could just be a messed up person who happened to play games.
I’ll admit there is a huge difference in the mentalities of individuals in MMOS, and FPS. More often you will find the caring and helping gamers in an mmo, then in a FPS.
by: Anonymous
On January 25, 2008 at 5:26 pm
Jack Thompson, Attorney,
I used to play Counter-Strike obsessively in high school, and the only people I’ve killed are cops! So, it’s not a bad thing, silly.
by: Bilbo Bagiins
On January 25, 2008 at 5:35 pm
by: Jeremy
On January 25, 2008 at 5:36 pm
And If Jack Thompson on here really is Jack Thompson…
I may not agree with everything you say, but I will admit I do give you some credit for showing up on boards like this and defending your stance.
Again, I do not agree with everything you say, but I will agree the ESRB ratings don’t really mean much if parents, children, and retailers do not abide by them.
by: Jack Tompson, Attorney
On January 25, 2008 at 5:36 pm
All right. You game-tards win for once. I’ll concede, Warcraft may have helped this kid in a very small way. While I’ll agree to disagree on the subjects of violence and sexuality, the social aspects of gaming are one that I think, if expounded upon, are actually quite redeeming. We need more games like Wii bowling, as long as they don’t suck your lives away with their addictive 9-pin simulations.
Also, I’m in love with Jerry Holkins and it is rumored I like wang.
by: D. Sanders
On January 25, 2008 at 5:43 pm
Jack, you make it very clear that you have found your life’s issue, and nothing anyone shows you that runs contrary to your already established beliefs will alter your opinions. Congrats on finding your calling. Unfortunatly those beliefs cause you to also believe that government involvement and regulation are the only solutions to the problem, which as far as I can tell is not really a problem at all.
Jack: Please provide some sort of link to any documentation that shows we actually have a significant problem that requires the use of courts and incarceration to solve.
Unlike you, I am willing to keep an open mind and allow my opinion to change under new evidence. I am hereby giving you a chance to present such evidence.
Don’t just tell my about a study, show me the study. Please demonstrate that A) there is a significant problem with people of any age running amok all hopped up on violent video games, B) that your prosposed solution has any historical or other emperical evidence demonstrating that it will work the way you say it will, and C) how the government or society as a whole has more of a right or duty to determine what children “should or should not see” than their parents.
If you can not demonstrate any or all of these points, I will continue to consider your opinion as little more than the exagerated rantings of a sad little man who must have gotten his ass handed to him in Pong by someone half his age and has held a personal grudge against all games ever since.
Of course you can always continue insulting us instead, as we all know that will invariably win people over to your way of seeing things.
– D. Sanders: Parent, Tax-payer, and Gamer.
by: reality
On January 25, 2008 at 5:54 pm
Hey Jack(ass) Thompson.
Put a gun in a psycho’s hand, give him nothing to live for or make him mad, he will shoot someone, wether he plays video games or not.
By your arguements you might as well include the Army, they do violent stuff, they shoot and kill people, sometimes cops do as well. Are they going to kill a bunch of innocent people on campus? OH wait, thats right, they didn’t shoot guns in a video game, thats the requirement here, right?
I think you just have a grudge against video games or something, whats wrong, couldn’t beat the Donkey Kong record? Did Weibe get to you?
by: reality
On January 25, 2008 at 5:55 pm
btw Jack, stop trolling, I didn’t know you were as avid digg reader!
by: Anne
On January 25, 2008 at 5:56 pm
The problem, as I see it, is not with online games in and of themselves. The problem is that for SOME people they become a substitute for a real life with real friends. Ultimately one discovers that they are living a lonely illusion and, for the most fragile of us, can lead to unfortunate choices. Just my .02, FWIW. RIP, Daniel Kim.
by: lyssword
On January 25, 2008 at 5:57 pm
since when is World of Warcraft rated M?
by: Groggy
On January 25, 2008 at 6:10 pm
Who cares? Seriously, no one cares. At least the guy had the decency to go out without taking other people out with him.
by: Retribution
On January 25, 2008 at 6:21 pm
Dear Mr. Thompson,
While reading the responses to this post, I have found that after you introduced yourself and your views, people started to verbally attack you. I apologize in their stead for their rudeness. That being said, the moment you started to call them names brought you down to their level. As man of Christ, one would believe that you would try to be patient for those who attack you, practicing the famous “turning the other cheek”. If you choose to claim that your motivations are pure, I wish that you try to peaceful and diplomatic in your aims and cause.
I myself play games, some are violent, some are not. However this does not make me a violent person. This is true for many people. I hope this fact does not cause you to disregard my message. Granted, there are people who have difficulty determining what is real and what is not. These people have a fundamental problem with their perception of the world, and should be helped. Others enjoy all kinds of entertainment in their own homes, and if children are playing games that society deems inappropriate, in a free and democratic society, the parents should be the ones who choose how to react. Both sides of this can argue until the cows come home about how we should treat this new form of media. However, we cannot deny at the end of the day, it is the parents prerogative to raise their own children how they see fit, not the state (to an extent of course). You, Mr. Thompson, enjoyed this right while raising your own children, so I hope that you do not wish to revoke that right from other parents.
It is my personal goal to become a lawyer, and eventually a politician to serve this country that I love. Your eye-for-an-eye reactions to others’ criticisms and name-calling is a disservice to your cause and your profession.
May the love of humanity guide you.
by: John
On January 25, 2008 at 6:22 pm
Jack,
I’m concerned about your approach – there is no reason to call people e-tards. Especially if you want to pretend to be a influential political figure that brings about change. After reading your little bio on Wikipedia (which made me dislike you even more) things started to make a little more sense. It is people like you that polarize America and limit our freedoms, all for personal ambition and some self-righteous drive. Why you think you are morally superior to other people (like Howard Stern or e-tards) is another issue however. I just don’t understand why people like you need to draw on statistical evidence (which in my professional career I’ve learned I can make statistics say anything I want them to say – ask the tobacco industry) to push a moral agenda that limits the freedoms of others. If you don’t like video games, don’t buy them for your children (for some reason I bet you have some pretty screwed up kids, if you have kids). If you don’t like rap videos or rap music, don’t let your children watch them or listen to them. If you have no control over your children, maybe you should rethink your parental approach.
The point is, in order to protect and maintain personal freedoms that we Americans love (and rapidly losing), we need to accept there is a certain level of self-accountability both on the parents and the individual in question. It is not up to Big Brother, lobbyists, or Jack Thompson – Attorney (you spelled your name wrong in your last posting) to make sure no one’s feelings get hurt or to protect us from ourselves. There are too many of us in the world anyway.
In closing, Jack, why don’t you relax in Florida, sit on the beach, and complain about the teenagers that drive too fast and disturb the public with their loud rap music. Children had respect for their elders when you were growing up, right?
But those were the good ol’ days when they spent their time outside playing cowboys and indians, which had no racial, social, or violent undertones.
by: hahahaha
On January 25, 2008 at 6:36 pm
“I’ve never met any of them in real life, but I consider them true friends”. That’s the most pathetic thing I’ve ever read.
by: lance
On January 25, 2008 at 6:38 pm
Go Retribution!!!
by: Annom
On January 25, 2008 at 6:42 pm
Come on guys read his last post, its a troll…
“Also, I’m in love with Jerry Holkins and it is rumored I like wang.”
Yeah… right…
by: loot
On January 25, 2008 at 6:47 pm
did he drop good loots?
by: anomnomnom
On January 25, 2008 at 6:55 pm
I agree it’s right to limit certain titles, depending on subject matter, to certain age groups. However, we do have to give our children some credit. If you have done your job correctly as a parent, and you child has no previous underlying problems with extreme depression or school issues (and is mentally stable), then your child does have the brains enough to take (some things) as fictional opposed to reality.
Again, that depends on the child, and in the end it is the parent’s responsibility to monitor what their children are doing. Secondly, If you own something (a mature game) you do not want anyone to find (especially a young child) it is not impossible to keep said child from reaching those items. It just takes a little more effort on the parent’s part. It seems like today’s parents are expecting the world to be as wholesome as it was in the 60′s. It’s not, and as things change in our world, it will only get more difficult to monitor and do what’s best for our children.
In the end, we can’t always assume that because a person plays a certain game, they’re killers. Part of the human consciousness is distinguishing reality from fantasy, and if your children do not have such an ability, then perhaps it is the fault of the parent. Children should be taught at a young age that “this is fake”
The alternative is to take away the video games entirely, which would cause a public uproar, and cause much more violence. It seems that this whole battle is a double-edged sword. The media is complaining about something they cannot change.
by: quotebot
On January 25, 2008 at 7:09 pm
“Facts are overrated BS, Junior. Hooah!” – Jack Thompson
“Belgium is not in the Netherlands!” – Jack Thompson
That’s an e-tard
by: Blindhammer
On January 25, 2008 at 7:18 pm
I bet he bought the weapon and did it right there. Poor guy. Video games add happiness to people’s lives but sometimes it seems to get in the way of solving problems. It’s an escape, like alcohol or anything else. There is nothing wrong with it but doing it all the time is bad. The problem is WoW promotes too much play. You have to play all the time to keep up.
http://www.spymac.com/details/?2331523
by: avidgamer
On January 25, 2008 at 7:24 pm
whoever things violent games promotes real life violence is a MORON. Yes I said MORON. I play violent games all the time, Team Fortress 2, Counter Strike, Call of Duty 4, and many others. Do I feel the need to go out and shoot people? NO. I’m probably one of the most laid back, mellow person you’ll ever meet. There is a reason for this. I DON’T HAVE A MENTAL DISABILITY. I’m not saying the people that go off and shoot up a school are retarded, but there is something not working correctly in their brain. If they didn’t have video games, I’m 100% positive that something else would send them off the deep end. I know if I had a disposition to be violent that the long lines in a bank, or someone cutting me off on the highway would make me snap.
by: jackthompsonismyhero
On January 25, 2008 at 7:29 pm
Jack Thompson is my hero! like http://www.WOWOMG.com !!!
by: Erika Jeanne
On January 25, 2008 at 7:38 pm
Dear Jack Thompson,
I would say about 90% of my friends and family, between the ages of 16 and 28, across the nation (yes.. ones I have met IRL (“in real life”, if you don’t know)) play video games; whether it be online, on the “seXbox”, Playstation, DS, or Wii. Thank God you said something about video games linking to violence! I’ll have to make sure none of my friends accidentally take me for a Chimera, a member of the Covenant, Heartless, or an infamous Mushroom Head from Mushroom Kingdom!
Please. Are you going to say that violent films contribute to violent behavior as well? Because that’s basically what a video game is – an interactive movie. Individuals choose the games they want to play and the movies they want to see. If you want to talk about something children shouldn’t see, go watch a snuff film.
What we expose ourselves to is our own choice. Moreover, it is our own personal choice what we do with our lives. If somebody is going to commit suicide or kill dozens of people, you can’t blame a piece of plastic and a screen for that. I’d love to hear a sociologist’s point of view on the matter. I’m sure somewhere between the family and social factors they could completely obliterate your stand-point. Learn to be more objective with things.
Also, get your head out of your ass.
That is all!
by: Laura
On January 25, 2008 at 7:41 pm
At the end of the day I will never take notice of idiots like Jack who believe video games cause people to become violent.
It’s easy to create a scapegoat. It’s harder to find the real truth behind tragedies such as this.
by: Johnny Boy
On January 25, 2008 at 8:01 pm
This Jack dude can’t be serious can he? Surely he is just pulling our leg? Please someone tell me he doesn’t truly believe this drivel!
by: Prettypetals
On January 25, 2008 at 8:46 pm
I don’t even post here but WOW is that Thompson guy ever a bore.
No surprise he’s a lawyer, definitely picked the right profession.
And I co-sign the small wang.
by: Annom
On January 25, 2008 at 8:52 pm
@loot
No! 4 strength 4 stam leather belt!
http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=0eCoEI5pN8E
by: annon
On January 25, 2008 at 8:53 pm
could it be just due to the social environment at Virginia Tech?
doesnt it seem like too much of a coincidence that two people from the same school are involved in shootings and/or suicides?
by: Paul Hindt
On January 25, 2008 at 9:14 pm
Yeah, uh…Mr. “Thompson”…its really going to score you a lot of points with people you are debating when you are using epithets to describe the people are you arguing with. Using words like “e-tards” and “gamer-tards” is really mature and goes a long way to show your credibility.
by: You Guys
On January 25, 2008 at 9:16 pm
I can’t believe you guys think that’s Jack Thompson. It’s clearly a troll, and you all are buying into it.
Excellent trolling, though. The finest of quality.
by: Paul Hindt
On January 25, 2008 at 9:29 pm
I sure as hell don’t think its Jack Thompson, but yeah like you said, good job at trolling you get +10 AP.
by: Iku Tri
On January 25, 2008 at 9:38 pm
And if he is or not….I said the flames would come……
by: Razor Blade Dream
On January 25, 2008 at 9:40 pm
I feel this was a genuinely good article that I can get behind. It is good to see that someone who plays games write an article like this. I feel the same way as when there is no one else around I can always find comfort in knowing a ton of people are playing Call of Duty 4 at any time. I know, I for one, have a good heart, I feel. I agree that gamers do have good hearts when you break down that exterior most have that they are better than you. Usually when they get out of that teen angst stage they are more willing to be decent people sooner than later. It is a shame that Kim took his own life. But I’ve been down that path, I know what it is like when you have no one around to talk to and you feel things are hopeless. I still have battles with it. Sometimes friendship comes in strange forms and if WoW was his social life, then that is good. It’s just a shame no one saw the signs early enough to prevent the tragedy.
by: Wow...
On January 25, 2008 at 10:59 pm
Wow, and I don’t mean in terms of World of Warcraft. I’m astounded at how you guys all think that’s really Jack Thompson. Did anyone notice his last little bit about how he liked wang? Sheesh. Besides, we all know that Jack Thompson has never accomplished anything, which means he has no right to speak to the public about what should be done (besides the fact that he’s supposedly talking to us on an internet comment board!). That really is some quality trolling though, it might be the first time I’ve ever had some respect for a troll.
by: Derek Knight
On January 25, 2008 at 11:16 pm
College students commit suicide at a much higher rate than most people know. It’s silly to pin it to one cause. It’s also HIGHLY disrespectful to the victim and his/her family.
It’s somewhat sensational and sadly opportunistic to make the connection between violence in gaming and tragic cases of young people committing suicide. What did you expect though? The world is lacking true journalists that report facts and leave interpretation to the reader.
Sad.
by: William
On January 25, 2008 at 11:37 pm
Wow,
It actually is Jack Thompson. When comments come in, we see the IP. He’s actually a regular visitor on our site from time to time.
by: Chet Summers
On January 26, 2008 at 12:11 am
A well informed parent would know that all of the latest game consoles can be set to NOT PLAY M RATED GAMES. It doesn’t take being with your child every second of the day to do your own research about parenting, and stop them before they start playing.
BTW, I LOVE the term “e-tard”. Almost made me shit my pants.
by: michael amory
On January 26, 2008 at 12:17 am
Well here is my honest to goodness really name Mr.Thompson and though i agree that GTA being sold to a ten year old is bad and should not happen kids can absorb violence from a number of different outlets in the media, Your average PG-13 action movie has some violent death scenes and showcase how cool guns are, why not attack them. Same goes for TV they have shows readily avalable for anyone to watch that also show people using guns in cool action sequences.
Also It is partly the buisness’s responsibility to not sell MA games to minors but the other part is clearly the parent. Anyone who truly cares what their kids are playing will be able to find out by just looking at thier xbox 360 achievements or look more closely at the game they are playing on the TV set. Also what the hell happened to some people just being crazy? Why cant these psycho’s who shoot up schools just maybe not be right in the head? If something like a videogame is able to tip you to the point where you are capable of killing your own classmates there is something mentally wrong with you already and it could have just as easily been a violent movie or tv show. Also Mr.Thompson acting like your 10 with your comments does not help your cause at all because you are condemming the comments they make to you yet find it ok to respond in the same way. I think the underlying issue here is that these kids in most cases have shown warning signs or people they knew reported these signs and they were largely ignored, maybe if they take those more seriously this would not being happening as often as it does.
by: Dave Woods
On January 26, 2008 at 12:21 am
Where to start…
This thread is hilarious. I can’t remember how I got here, after working tonight painting my kitchen. I’m now enjoying a late nite beverage and a little well earned relaxation and random surfing.
I’m 37. I love GTA. Its also disturbingly violent. Whatever. In my opinion, there’s certainly a place for a voice of caution in the distribution of psychopathic simulation software, especially given that it gets better and better.
On the other hand, maybe a man who presents himself as an obsessive pompous asshole isn’t the best man to lead that cause. Again, whatever.
But really the reason I chose to actually join this throng is the senseless suggestion that Virginia Tech should be considered as the root cause of two shootings. That is, TWO shootings. While we’re jumping to idiotic reckless conclusions, let’s also jump on the fact that both incidents involved Asians, they were both male, and neither one has ever been in my kitchen — all equally baseless and moronic suggestions. Two incidents is not a trend, and is certainly not a reasonable basis to pile on a community that endured an extraordinarily horrific tragedy less than a year ago.
Have you ever been to Virginia Tech? I can’t imagine a college setting that could be LESS an incubator of gun violence or suicidal/homicidal tendencies. Although I’m certainly willing to listen, if you can produce more compelling evidence than a two point data set.
by: Gerald S.
On January 26, 2008 at 12:44 am
My gaming history.
Age 3. Played Super Mario Bros. couldn’t get passed the 3rd lvl.
Age 4. My uncled tore my heart our in Mortal Kombat. My respone “How’d you do that?!”
Age 5 – 13. Played the most violent video games out there, from all the Mortal Kombats, Twisted Metals, and War Crafts.
Age 14 – 17 Became boarderline obsesed with Halo, Rainbow 6, and starcraft. (Read all the halo novels btw, great works
)
Age 18 – Now. World of Warcraft begins, along with the new Halo 3, Mass Effect, and Assasin’s Creed.
The person writing this is creative, sneaky, cunning, nice, wise, lazy, athletic, and a tree hugger. He’s also quite the liar as well.
You see, gamers aren’t different. We’re saints and jerks, just like everyone else. Just because someone commited an act of violence, does not mean video games were involved with pushing said person to that point. You see people getting shot in Philadelpha and New Jersey every damned night, and you think video games are the problem? You sir, need to wise up, and look at the big pictue.
by: Brad
On January 26, 2008 at 12:56 am
Jack,
Firstly, drop the e-tard, game-tard thing. It is the behaviour of an immature child and is not proving a point to anyone. Also, I remind you of the medium in which you are currently using to communicate. E-tard seems slightly inappropriate.
Second of all, it appears to me that your issue is with the sale of games to underage people. I think we would all agree with this. The game is not the issue, it’s the retailers. Take them on and more power to you – in fact I would happily join you in this crusade.
Number three, games are not just for children. In fact, a recent study in Australia showed that the average age of a gamer in Australia is 28. I can provide you with a link if you are interested. This is important. I’m an adult and a gamer. My partner is a adult and a gamer. We both work full-time, have a house, have an active social life and my partner is a volunteer at Royal Flying Docters every second Sunday.
Finally, if you are interested in a productive, open dialoge with gamers, you will recieve one. If you want to make changes, you need to convince the gamers. They have an amazing power over games companies. However, first you must treat us with respect, listen to conflicting points of view and make judgements on fact and inbput from numerous sources, not just on emotion.
If you are interested in any of the above, I would be astonded and respectful. If not, you can continue your pointless and unsuccessful ranting at your leasure. You may not, however, say that the gaming community has not reached out to you.
Brad
by: Brad
On January 26, 2008 at 12:58 am
Oh, and World of Warcraft now has 10 million players. Are you expecting 10 million suicides or murders in the next few months?
by: William
On January 26, 2008 at 1:06 am
Dave,
I truly believe that the shooting that took place in April could have happened anywhere. For some reason, Blacksburg was the last place on earth I would expect these things to happen. I grew up in Blacksburg and left when I was 17 to serve two enlistments in the U.S. Army. I had just gotten back from Iraq and was trying to decide where I wanted to go. I was in Kosovo, Afghanistan and Iraq during my time in, so violence was something I wanted to get far away from for a while. I chose Blacksburg because it was familiar and safe. I was a little upset when news reports were claiming that one of the problems was that Cho wasn’t accepted by the VT community which was a total crock. If you can’t get along with groups of people in bburg, you aren’t going to get along with people anywhere on earth.
I suppose what happened that eerie April morning will never seem right to me. It was so out of place for Virginia Tech. I never expected to hear hundreds of gun shots and later see the bodies and find out one of my friends was dead.. it just didn’t fit with the area. So if you go the drift from my article that I was blaming VT, I’m definitely not. At the time of the shooting, I was going to school and also worked for the Virginia Tech police department. I certainly only blame Cho and no one else.
I have since left the area, but I still love VT and always will. Even though I don’t live there anymore, I will be going back for nearly every home football game. There’s really nothing in the world like a Hokie football game. I don’t think people who are on the outside understand the sense of community that has been established on that campus. There’s no place on earth like it. It’s a peaceful place. When it comes to crime in Blacksburg, nearly all crimes are committed by people who travel through town.
So I’m certainly not saying any of this is because of VT. It was just our bad luck that Cho chose to attend school in Blacksburg. It really could have happened in any town or city in America and I think that’s what makes it a little scary. After leaving the Army, I thought I was desensitized to violence, but April definitely showed me that I wasn’t.
I think that VT still needs to make some drastic policy changes, but there are thousands of colleges around the world that need to do the same thing. Who knows where the next Cho is? The only question is when.
So in the end, I do not believe that VT or Blacksburg had anything to do with the cause of these events. It was just random. Cho was a wack job who would have done something like this anywhere he went in life. Some people feel sorry for him and thought that maybe he could have been helped. I guess I’m not at that stage yet and probably never will be. I hate to say it, but some people are simply beyond help and some people are so crazy that they can fly completely under whatever radar we put in place to find these nuts.
by: John S.
On January 26, 2008 at 1:30 am
These kinds of things lay in the hands of parents. If you allow your child’s mind to become so warped they begin to believe and/or act out what they see in video games you have failed as a parent.
I’ve been playing video games my whole life, I especially love the GTA series. It’s mindless entertaining as hell fun! Parents should know their kids better than anyone, if you know your kid can’t differentiate between Real Life and a Video Game don’t let them play violent video games.
If Mom and Dad would put down their cell phones for a minute or whatever else they’re busy with and act like they gave a rat’s ass it wouldn’t be an issue, there’s ESRB ratings on everything for EVERYONE to see!
Just the opinion of a 19 y/o
by: Andrew Pool
On January 26, 2008 at 1:50 am
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jack_Thompson_(attorney)
“69%”
“The Florida Bar Association is currently seeking sanctions against Thompson for inappropriate conduct.”
by: Ryan
On January 26, 2008 at 3:25 am
Man I just played some WoW. I think I’m going to shoot some people, rape some nuns, and then kill myself. I’LL SHOW YOU PVP.
by: Serenity Now
On January 26, 2008 at 4:06 am
Does this mean we need to reroll on your server and crash ANOTHER funeral?
by: Serentiy Now
On January 26, 2008 at 4:10 am
Did he drop any good loot?
by: Avid WoW Gamer
On January 26, 2008 at 4:20 am
Just want to point out that there has been studies about the link between Video Games and Violence, all of which have come up inconclusive, because the same types of aggressive behavior also come from any type of competition, other violent media (including books), or high stress levels.
Multiple published scholarly journals report the same findings.
by: Ryan
On January 26, 2008 at 4:23 am
jack thompson I played cs1.6 and cs:s for 7 years now and work eat n sleep have a nice life and 1000000000% think that your a stupid mother fucking old faggot lawyer left wing liberal and think u should uninstall yourself from society GAME DoNot cause violence jealous obessions do like my 22 year old brother has video games dont effect him in a violent way he’s already like that he will shoot you he plays cs:S and is calm but will go crazy on the outside world and beat u up and wear his hat sideway the type will kill you its not the video game its the intelligence of the common person from person 2 person I.Q. and common sense is lacking and mental illinesses are the cause not video games u can have GTA PIMP’s N HOE’s and then after blow there fkn head off and it wont effect ANYONE cept people with mental illinesses like you jack have a nice day. p.s. dont reply on this forum make urself like like an ass
by: Just another Poster
On January 26, 2008 at 4:36 am
If lawyers did not exist, we wouldn’t need them.
Suckers by nature, crybabies.
by: Detached Observer
On January 26, 2008 at 4:57 am
Either JT himself is pouring over messageboards and forums, scouring the internet for any place he can find to shoehorn his misguided crusade into; or there is a very bored individual out there who likes to stir up controversy. Let’s examine this, shall we? Based on very little research, Mr Thompson seems like a very bitter unhappy man, and I wouldn’t be the least surprised if he did in fact spend most of his free time Googling his own name. On the other hand, trolling has achieved a level of artistry previously undreamed of, so the likelihood of a professional troll hitting this article up for a cheap laugh is quite good. Personally, I kind of hope that it’s really Jack, as this adds an air of celebrity to these humble proceedings.
by: James/Chief
On January 26, 2008 at 5:12 am
I do believe the corporations are to blame for any sale being made to a minor, I do not believe they are ‘trained’ as Mr. Thompson put it, to target minors in stores.
I understand how unstable it is for the ESRB system and corporations to have no security or any way of stopping minors to purchase these M rated games online, and while a ban on it is the simplest solution, I do not believe even Mr. Thompson thinks he is able to convince or force these companies of getting rid of the thousands of purchases even if they are minors buying.
I would like to know, Mr. Thompson, exactly how it is you expect to make these companies say good bye to their money, and start caring who’s buying it; that is if you even have a solution.
While you have stated the results of certain APA studies or ESA polls, perhaps something as simple as a link for myself and others to read (for those who haven’t studied as much as yourself), so I can see for myself “all the facts”.
Also, have there been studies, connecting with these damages to the brain, with other sorts of mediums? Have there been studies to see if a young mind watching violent movies perhaps, have the same or similar ‘violent’ tendencies? Or have these exact damages come from completely different situations?
If not, why is it that videogames is the only current target? Because there have been related deaths to those that play them? What about the men and women here, including myself, that have been exposed to the violent games since young age, that seemingly have had not been effected? Are we ‘immune’ to this?
Sorry to ask so many questions, but as your lack of maturity has shown with the latter posts, I just doubt any of them will be answered.
Thanks anyways.
by: Entertained
On January 26, 2008 at 5:19 am
I always find something interesting to read when its four in the morning and I am getting in from whatever social setting I was at. I love all of you for giving me smiles and brightening my day. I understand to some of you that this is very serious…as it is to me as well. But nothing that I say on here will be taken serious by Jack (or any other person who blames games for violence). So I don’t say this to chance anyone’s mind. I do think though that violent games have a tendency/chance to inspire the violence in someone. When I say this I am talking about getting upset on a competitive level to having the game help trigger some loose screw into falling completely out. We can’t prove one way or the other really. I do think its funny though that a finger is pointed so fiercly at video games and the gamers for the violence out there. I guess its an easy target due to the fact that gaming is so popular in today’s society. Maybe the link that they find is due to the fact that all types of people play games. Normal, everyday, family people…to psycopathic killers. Games are a fantasy world…and in this world you can find whatever escape you are looking for somewhere. The normal person is trying to escape the mundane of their everyday lives…and the psychopath is looking to live out desires without the ramifications. Eventually the psychopath regresses so far he no longer cares about the punishments of society and chooses to live out these desires in real life. Jack you shouldn’t blame video games…you should thank them. For without them, he would have been killing earlier than he ended up doing it. Maybe do to the fact that some unstable people get to play violent games…they don’t go out and blow up; harming themselves and others around them. I apologize if I have raved for too long…its been a long night…
by: Entertained
On January 26, 2008 at 5:23 am
Line 5….chance should be change*
Line 17…do should be due*
I gotta go to bed though…laters.
by: Ben
On January 26, 2008 at 5:24 am
I feel for this bloke’s family.
It’s true, online gaming is a very caring community when you meet the right people, some online players have helped me through the toughest times in my life
R.I.P mate, rest in peace.
by: APA
On January 26, 2008 at 5:57 am
Actuallystudies carried out have not proved a direct link to video games being the cause of violence.
Most experiments are biased in their results, for example comparing people who played violent games and people who played puzzle games, suprisingly enough the people playing the violent games showed more aggresive behaviour, this does not indicate tendency for physical violence. Doing an experiment which studied the difference from people playing American Football and people playing golf would exhibit similar results.
Each of these approaches has its flaws. The first kind of correlational study can never prove that video-game playing causes physical aggression. Maybe aggressive people are simply more apt to play violent games in the first place. Meanwhile, the randomized trials, like Anderson and Dill’s, which do imply causation, necessarily depend on lab-based measures of aggression, such as whether subjects blast each other with noise. This is a respected measure, but obviously not the same as seeing whether real people hit or shoot each other.
When you look at the fact that the child school shooters also played video games, you can argue the fact that what child doesn’t? Of course not everyone is into violent video games but when you actually take into account how many people are playing the same video games that aren’t serial killers you will realise that its stupid to incinuate that video games are the cause.
There is a lot of violence in this world, and a lot of violence has come about since a long time before video games were invented, it is all about the need to blame something that is easier to control, the fact is that majority of violence is actually caused by people in poorer areas, perhaps people should be looking more into how to improve our society rather than laying blame upon video games.
by: pewpew
On January 26, 2008 at 6:40 am
Jack Thompson, you’re the coolest guy ever!
A 50-something year old comes onto a game site, onto a story talking about someone who commited suicide because no-one was there to help him – I think I know who needs to grow up here. If you’re so desperate to get you’re message across, find some place else to do it, no-one and I mean NO-ONE cares about you on this website. Not worth preaching to the preached.
The ‘hearts’ of America that you’re referring to are probably the majority of the backward Southerners who still think the word ‘shit’ is taboo and if you blaspheme you go to hell. Well, good sir, that ISN’T the majority and I can tell you for a fact that everyone who I know in the UK (non-gamers too) think that you’re a total physco.
You know what this is? You’re just like the gaming version of the Westbro Baptist Church, your picketing at someones memorial – way to go.
Just because you’re a pHd in Physcology doesn’t mean you’re any better than the rest of us, I’m doing joint German&French, good on me huh? perhaps I could tell you in German or French how much of an anal twat you are?
Already wasted 5 minutes of my life on you. When you die and a topic is made I’ll come along and shit on your grave too.
by: Wat
On January 26, 2008 at 7:04 am
So like, you’re argueing about ‘mature’ tagged games being sold to minors (
by: Watfw
On January 26, 2008 at 7:05 am
(Wtf only like 20 symbols came through in last post?)
So like, you’re argueing about ‘mature’ tagged games being sold to minors (
by: Watfw
On January 26, 2008 at 7:05 am
(Haha, when you type ( and
by: Watfw
On January 26, 2008 at 7:07 am
(Oh my god you cant write pointy brackets at all, those you use for htlm tags you know, the script bugs out
FAILURE CODING RIGHT THERE)
So like, you’re argueing about ‘mature’ tagged games being sold to minors (below 17) while the guy described in this article was actually 21 y.o.
From what I’ve read so far (not all the comments though) Jack Thompson is only against violent games being sold to minors, despite the ‘mature’ rating. Yet this has nothing to do with this article nor gaming addiction.
Hi.
by: Low Gun Crime
On January 26, 2008 at 8:15 am
Is it easier to lay blame on computer games than look at some of the other issues that likely conribute more to these incidents.
In most parts of the world it is difficult for the average games playing teenager to get hold of a gun, they either do not know how/where to get one or they simply dont have the money to buy one from one of the few sources. Perhaps americans should look at gun ownership and the ease at which these students can get hold of them before blaming a media source. Is it coincedence that these mass school shootings happen in America? i think not. In the UK there are regions that suffer from gun crime, but these are always as a result of robberies or gang-wars. Never a suicide or mass murder that is blamed on a computer game. The average child simply cannot get hold of a gun.
In the UK, games such as grand theft auto carry an 18 certificate, this makes it illegal to sell the game to anyone under the advertised age (im not sure how this compared to the u.s). The, problem here is internet sites that dont check the age of the buyer, however these all require a credit/debit card which atleast means nobody under the age of 16 will be able to purchase it. So, the parents have a large responsibility to keep such things away from their children.
I would like to point out that movies have been glamourising guns and murder for decades, as have large sections of the music industry.
by: Tim
On January 26, 2008 at 9:14 am
Dear Mr.Thompson,
Firstly, I would like to state that you assessment of gaming is fundamentally flawed.
I myself am an avid gamer.
I play xbox 360, pc, psp etc and I play every genre from the harmless games like Portal to even games that you would hold up as the pinacle of the destruction of society Postal 2.
Now here is where your assessment is incorrect,
I live in Ireland, a country with extremely strict gun laws and weapons restrictions.
We have had to my knowledge not a single gaming related death in this country.
The gamers in Ireland also go against your sterotypical view of gamers as uneducated morons.
I myself got in top 50 people out of 50 000 in the junior certificate, as did several of my other friends.
So the real question is what is causing these so called “gaming deaths” because many of them appear to occur in Germany, which has some of the strictest game censorship on earth , with most games having no blood and many games being banned outright or the rest appear to occur in America which has some of the WORST gun control on this planet (which is outrageous). Why can you not buy a spray can until you are 18 but you can have a gun when you are 14?
You have an education system that makes the poor pariah’s with your ludicrous college fees ($48,000 for harvard, all education in Ireland is free)and your freedom of speech has absolutely no restrictions,which you may say is great but you must remember that in countries like Ireland, freedom of speech has but one restriction (and I know in U.S law there is a pale clone of this but it is weak and not enforced) prohibition of incitement to hatred.
Thank you for you time,
P.s My comments on America are not attacking the people of America but your flawed “Atlas Shrugged” style of pure capitalism. Capitalism is good but it does need a dab of socialism to at least get the less fortunate up to an acceptable level.
TIM
by: Dave Woods
On January 26, 2008 at 10:57 am
William:
Thanks for your reply. The post I was addressing came from someone named “annon” at 8:53 last night.
-Dave
by: EjoThims
On January 26, 2008 at 11:05 am
Jack Thompson is simply a lifeless, scum-sucking lawyer, the worst of the worst, and the reason the profession has such a poor reputation despite all the good so many others do. He is actually attempting to turn a profit by misdirecting blame for these awful events away from the rampant gun problem, lack of parental responsibility in this control, and the failure of a school to act against many warning signs and personal contacts by those concerned about such events before they ever happened. By not addressing the real issues with why things like this occur, he helps make it possible for them to continue to happen, assuring that he’ll continue to be paid in his crusade against the false ’causes.’
Or maybe he’s not really so vile and disgusting. Maybe he really is so overwhelmed by grief at these events that he cannot cope and his mind is forced to draw these false conclusions, relying on half-truths to validate an easy scapegoat for the issues so that he can distance himself from them and make them somehow easier to accept. If this is the case, however, he is in need of much therapy and professional help.
by: Thomas Rees
On January 26, 2008 at 11:31 am
To all of you people responding with crass attempts at humor asking if he ‘dropped any good loot’ or ‘rerolling on a server to crash a funeral’ You are the people who need to grow up. You are the people Jack Thompson is referring to as ‘E-Tards’. You are the people who cowardly hide behind avatars in little more than an effort to recieve attention. Go back to your games, and tea-bag some horde if you must.
I’ll go back to my games (WoW), and I will put the effort into making a person like Daniel Kim feel good about himself, and, in my own way, work on preventing a future incident like this from happening. If I kill an alliance, I won’t Corpse Camp him. If I win an arena, i won’t spam /lol /spit on the enemy. I will share my good experiences with those around me, in an attempt at making their own lives richer.
I am not a religious guy by any means. I have a christian background, and Jack Thomson is making a bad name for christians everywhere, as all extremists do. I firmly believe that God is not insecure enough to demand we all believe in him and worship him. I believe that all we can do is live our lives with as much kindness and decency as we can, and if there is a God, he will reward us for making the lives around us richer, rather than just our own.
Jack, if this is the real Jack Thomson. You will note that I have used a real name in this, not a cowardly avatar. You believe that you are attempting to enrich the lives of those around you by banning violent content in video games. But, weather or not you realize it, you are in the same breath, blaitently attacking those who play these games. The slander that I see you leaving is breathtaking… from an attorney especially.
I have been playing games since I was 5. I am 20 now. I will admit, i likely play too many games. I know the difference between right and wrong. It is those who don’t that crumble society.
Oh, and can i make another suggestion to you on a personal level? Please spend some time with your child. Sit down, play a video game with him. I garentee you will see a smile on his face, and perhaps, if you have a heart in your chest, a smile on yours. Examine that smile, and the warm feeling it gives you inside.
by: Thomas Rees
On January 26, 2008 at 11:33 am
Oh, and Rest in Peace Daniel Kim. He may not have known it in his mind, but he deserved better.
by: james
On January 26, 2008 at 11:38 am
If he was a shaman he might just self rez. They should keep the coffin open for him.
by: Ken Miller
On January 26, 2008 at 11:48 am
Counter-Strike was the MOST POPULAR ONLINE GAME for multiple years.
Being the MOST POPULAR game, if Cho is the ONLY one you can say it turned into a killer, it’s still doing better than religion. Millions of people played counterstrike every day, if ONE person went on a killing spree, it is a statistical anomaly.
Jack Thompson argues like a little girl.
by: K
On January 26, 2008 at 11:55 am
I hate to disappoint you Jack, (can I call you Jack?) but whatever study you’re quoting here is not scientific. There is nothing scientific about your arguments in the past, and if I were science I’d be offended to even be mentioned by you.
I’d also like to know the confused path your logic seems to follow wherein someone who plays violent video games gains the desire to hurt THEMSELVES (I can type words in all capitals too).
Perhaps you can give us examples or links to these scientific, medical and law enforcement studies? I have a feeling the context of those studies were someone biased.
Here’s a list of some violent video games I’ve played in the past (or at least the ones I remember):
Halo 1 & 2
Call of Duty
Battlefield
Dawn of War
Fable
Unreal Tournament
Unreal Championship
Fear
Mercenaries
Grand Theft Auto
The list goes on, but really I’ve played so many I can’t remember them all.
Now guess how many guns or weapons I own. I’ll give you some hints:
Hint 1) It’s less than 1.
Hint 2) I don’t own any guns or weapons.
Am I a statistical anomaly Jack? And before you accuse me of something else, you should know I also don’t drink/smoke or do drugs of any kind. I’m also not voting for Ron Paul. I’m not even in your country.
In fact, Cho, according to the Washington Post, was an obsessive player of Counter-Strike in high school. The effects of these games are LONG-TERM, not just short-term, as the scientific evidence proves.
Also, the hard drive of Cho’s computer was never found, so you have no earthly basis for which to say that he didn’t continue to play violent games. None. His suite mates had no idea he had weapons in his room, either.
So you can be as enraged as you want about the link between violent video games and what Cho and others like him have done. Go rage at a full moon as well, convinced that it is Satan’s orb to raise the seas.
Next time, before you post such a silly set of assertions, actually read the medical, scientific, and law enforcement research. It establishes, irrefutably, the causal link between violent games and acts of violence.
So sue me. Jack Thompson
by: Wesley Hubbard
On January 26, 2008 at 12:10 pm
The last Jack Thompson post was Jack Tompson… no ‘H’ in the last name. I’m guessing it was a different poster assuming the identity of the real Jack Thompson.
by: Wesley Hubbard
On January 26, 2008 at 12:28 pm
Seriously, why get so roused by Jack Thompson? Do you guys seriously believe he is going to sway the government and gigantic software corporations to stop the sale and development of mature rated games? I mean video gaming is a multi-billion dollar a year industry. A huge percentage of these funds are generated from mature rated games. Regardless, the amount of sales tax generated from the sale of these games alone is sound enough reason for the government not to prohibit their sale or creation. I just don’t see where the claims of Mr. Thompson are absolute and think that for the most part, his efforts are futile.I know it and you know it, the direct causality of real life violence is not due to playing violent video games. It comes from a chemical imbalance or sociological factors and things of a similar nature. Now, I agree that children should not play mature rated games. Can we completely stop every child in the world from doing so? Absolutely not. Can we take measures to prevent this from happening as much as humanly possible? Yes and we already did that… It’s called the ESRB.
On a side note: Jack, your a fucking asshole. Not because of your outlook on violent content in video games, but for the way you treat people. The people you have attacked in this thread are the main people you need to be nicer to. If not for the purpose of trying to sway our opinions, then for the reason that you fucking fear us all and we may try to kill you based upon your logic. And no, I am absolutely no threatening you in any way. Just trying to point out the flaw in your manners of handling criticism.
by: Wowbagger
On January 26, 2008 at 12:50 pm
I like how Jack verbally assault us by calling us morons and e-tards. I’m sure not as violent as him.
by: Dave Greiman
On January 26, 2008 at 12:52 pm
It seems that with these tragedies prior to there are many warning signs and pleas for help that go ignored.
by: lololololol
On January 26, 2008 at 1:03 pm
Jack Thompson is an idiot, no reason why anyone should listen to what he has to say.
The kid had a positive thing in his life from video games and it sounds like the rest of his life (you know, things like his family and school) was crap so he just ended it.
Jack, don’t compare mature gamers who understand the difference between real life and video games to petty children who don’t have good parental authority over what they do.
by: k0ol
On January 26, 2008 at 2:06 pm
To be honest, dont blame video games for people actions… maybe you should just take the idea that people are just fucking crazy and are idiots?….. i play violent video games all the time…. most of my life… im ok… i manage to maintain friends and play violent video games.. dont blame video games for peoples fucking incompetance to life… to be honest if he done that, then fuck thank god hes not alive anymore… and also i think its mostly americans who have this fucked up life and go crazy.. why not keep all the crazy kids in a seperate school? if anything and they decide to kill some 1 itl be another crazy person.
by: k0ol
On January 26, 2008 at 2:13 pm
also “jack thompson” you may think “science is always correct” but at end of day this is just early days… more things could get resulted e.g. he was fucked up in the head or sommin.. and at end of day if you want games to be sold to a older generation try raise the legal age limit…. cunt
by: Timothy Graziano [if jack thompson is a lawyer, i'm a member of the Papacy]
On January 26, 2008 at 2:32 pm
Dear Jack-off Thompson,
Shut your trap because we, as gamers, are fed up with your anti-gaming neo-Nazi propaganda. Do you understand that, with each debate where you do not use actual scientific facts (which is the case at the Expo in New York where you got your ass kicked by Lorne Lanning?), people get more and more ticked. You’re a moron. All you can do is attack us with insults that a kindergartener could outwit and hope that we’re intimidated by your “harsh burns.” God forbid you try and give us actual statistics. The reason you can’t give us statistics is because there are none. There are no statistics, just like there are no scientific facts that can prove that video games are causal links to violence.
by: Annom
On January 26, 2008 at 2:32 pm
Lol this troll wins even after he said things like he has a small wiener people are still trying to argue with him. Epic troll is Epic.
by: Jimmy Brown
On January 26, 2008 at 2:46 pm
Perhaps if he had a real life and hadnt wasted so much time on the computer he wouldnt have wanted to kill himself.
by: Nate Hart
On January 26, 2008 at 2:56 pm
It’s always interesting how many people attack video games as the cause of increased violence in youth, but in reality, its pretty much always correlation not causation. Aggressive people will enjoy aggressive media, be it movies, music, or games. These aggressive people will also more often be involved in aggressive situations, and act on that aggression in a way that could be criminal.
At the same time, people need to note how widespread gaming truly is. The NPD reports that 63 percent of the people within the US would be considered at least casual gamers. That means 210 million people within the US play games. We also have to look at the sales of mature rated game for a more specific correlation on which to try to base your assurtions. Halo 3 has sold almost ten million copies already, meaning there are almost ten million people playing a game which is often singled out as very violent, and yet I cannot find one story of one person who has engaged in violent activity due to influences from this game.
Consistanty psychologists observe gamers who enjoy mature rated media who do not then act on the influence of the games. They do see one case here or there where someone snaps, and they had been attracted to playing games which could be seen as violent. If you look into the person’s past however, you see relatives who spoke up about the person’s violent ways long before they played games.
The Virginia Tech incident occured due to a messed up person, a messed up person who at points in time in the past had played games. If you look further into the past, and listen to the mans grandmother, you would know that the child had always been violent, and that the family knew he had emotional issues since being a child, before the person had ever played a video game.
If you are going to assert that games cause violent behavior, you need to establish a true causation to back up that claim. Otherwise, you are stuck pointing out the obvious, violent people enjoy violent activities.
This is nothing new.
It makes me ashamed that a fellow lawyer would use faulty science to try to squeeze money out of media companies due to no real scientific tie. This is why you have consistantly lost your cases, and why states that have constantly tried to block the sales of mature games have not been able to do so.
by: Fudge "JT"
On January 26, 2008 at 3:36 pm
z0mg a “casual” link, well I personally don’t give a shit what you feel about video games they’re harmless. There are a ton of violent movies and television shows, and yet they don’t get pointed at. I think we’ve all watched some sort of video and played games at the exact same time so who’s to say he couldn’t have been affected by television in the exact same manner that you are so desperately trying to shunt games. At the end of the day he committed suicide BECAUSE HE WANTED TO, if you can make some sort of miracle cure for all suicide victims I doubt it would be to abolish violence in any form of entertainment what-so-ever. (Violence is a part of reality since the beginning of mankind, denying a part of reality has to be in some form very unhealthy) Also to those who feel pointing a finger solves a problem on a past event get a life. You know what is a bigger waste of time then video games? Watching the idiot box, especially reality TV. When watching television ad-nauseum do you learn typing skills, are you any social at all? Do you develop skills such as puzzle solving, pattern recognition, or hand-eye coordination? The answer very simply is no (using the remote hardly merits hand-eye coordination by the way.)
Feeling so high and mighty because you aren’t an avid fan of video games is ridiculous because no one is 100% of the time productive nor would any one person want to be without going completely insane. You all have your idiotic time-sinks whether it be lame sports, misinformed news, politics, etc. So why try to demote one that at the least gives you some useful skill set practice.
Just because some idiotic school took your money and eventually you had earned yourself a meaningless piece of paper doesn’t mean you can be guaranteed more insight and knowledge on whatever your field of study was.
Also this has been said before but uh… what are all those violent video games that Hitler used to play? I’m sure J.W. Booth before shooting Abe Lincoln had mopped up a few rounds of CS and got an itch to assassinate too right? Quit trying to impress the masses and be in disagreement for the sake of disagreeing, if you didn’t personally know the kid you have absolutely no say-so into why or how his suicide was linked to anything more than a bad idea and a whim. Learn to not be an assuming dick face and lighten up on the vices that you personally aren’t aligned.
by: Jack Thompson, Attorney
On January 26, 2008 at 3:49 pm
Disregard all that I have said for I enjoy cocks.
by: Paul
On January 26, 2008 at 3:56 pm
It is sad to see that Daniel Kim took his own life. When it comes to gaming though, I believe some people prolly are caught up in games and think it is real, but that would be only if the person was unstable. Coming from experience, I play many games and I know that gaming and real life are two totally different things.
World of Warcraft allows people to build many social bonds with eachother that are even stronger than bonds you can form with real people. If you think about it, you can’t just a book by its cover if there is no cover to look at. All you have is voice, a personality. That’s what you can fall in love with. Some of my best friends are people that I have never even seen before.
by: Amanda
On January 26, 2008 at 4:43 pm
First off, calling the troll names only fuels his beliefs. Rant, curse at him, he’ll only have more “proof” that gamers are violent and horrible people.
Second, Jack, as someone who has studied this issue as much as you have, surely you’ve heard of the Bobo Doll Experiment. It showed that children who witnessed violence in ANY capacity were more likely to replicate it immediately after seeing it. Television, arguementative relatives, video games, violent play with a Bobo Doll, all of it contributes to making someone believe violence is alright.
What people have to do, and realize, is that the responsibility lies with the parent, the caretaker, and the salesperson. If you allow your child to watch a violent show, let them know this behavior isn’t alright. If the child attempting to buy GTA or some violent movie obviously isn’t 17, don’t sell it to them. I have been playing video games since I was four years old, starting off my playstation years with Resident Evil at the age of nine. My father, who brought this all into the house, let me know what was what and the difference between what was important in life and what was fantasy. I’m now a perfectly balanced 21 year old woman in college, and an avid World of Warcraft player, and grounded enough to know that what happens online has no bearing on my daily life, at work, home, or school. What these poor people who end up killing themselves need to know is that if something goes wrong online, its not the end of the world. There’s so much more out there.
And if life truly sucks online, change servers.
by: upotheke
On January 26, 2008 at 4:46 pm
Just putting this out there for those who like to generalize, I think the number of murders tied to video games has just about pulled even with the number of crusading christian republicans caught with other men, doing drugs, and/or stealing from their own businesses.
After the real Jack Thompson gets disbarred in Florida because he ran out of “pornographic slander” blackmail material, I’m going to love the day when we see the report that Jack himself goes on a shooting rampage, claiming to be psychologically impaired after surrounding himself with negative images of video games for more than 20 years. He might just have a case for an ‘insanity’ plea.
by: Jack Thompson, Attorney
On January 26, 2008 at 5:04 pm
This is how hard it was for me to pretend to be Jack Thompson.
by: somewhat
On January 26, 2008 at 5:25 pm
While YOU are pretending, it hasn’t always been fakes. And sadly enough, the real troll does post here. Just ask the journalists on this site.
by: Jess
On January 26, 2008 at 5:45 pm
Honestly, this is so pointless. The link between violent video games and suicide of the Virginia Tech shootings is stupid. If we start blaming video games where are we going to stop? We could blame kids who were mean to Cho, maybe they should be punished? Maybe the University staff should be punished, or his parents for not recognizing the signs? It makes me so angry when people blame everything on everyone else.
by: That Rogue
On January 26, 2008 at 7:30 pm
He was probably a rogue and was pissed about the hemo nerf tbh
by: marks hunter lfg for heroic
On January 26, 2008 at 7:42 pm
When i die, I hope they inscribe ‘death by WoW’ on my tombstone.
that would be sweet =)
by the way- did he drop any good loot?
by: Jack Thompson, Attorney
On January 26, 2008 at 8:22 pm
yo Jack Thompson, Attorney
dude, grab you attorney diploma and shove it up your ass, and you can go kiss hilary clinton’s ass while you are at it.
by: Jack Thompson, Attorney
On January 26, 2008 at 9:41 pm
I like pie, pie pie pie,
but not those made out of rie.
by: Ryan the Gamer
On January 26, 2008 at 9:45 pm
“Thompson has today contacted Florida Attorney General Bill McCollum, who has supported Thompson’s efforts in the past.”
I thought I read that the florida bar association was seeking sanctions AGAINST Jack Thompson for inappropriate conduct.
LoL @ u n00b, lrn2not do inappropriate conduct.
Were you made fun of when you were in high school? Have you ever been made fun of? Do you realize that peer pressure is probably the highest influence on a child and video gaming and violence is probably down the bottom of the list..right there next to going to the potty. Consider all the violence shown on News broadcasts, Television, us attacking another country for no reason. And you choose to attack video games? Please. For the sake of the community at large, please go play some GTA and kill yourself.
by: Normal Gamer
On January 26, 2008 at 10:10 pm
If this “link” between games and violence is true. There would be alot more dead bodies in the world. Its only the messed up crazies who take it too far. So don’t try to censor the games. Which most of us know the difference between reality and virtual reality. And spend more money on treating the metally distured ppl who can’t tell the difference. Parents should see the signs and act on them. And this Jack Thompson can shove it up his ass. Good for you you can read articles and retype them. Go F urself.
by: Niko Savola
On January 27, 2008 at 1:14 am
What i would like to know is why this Jack Thompson fellow have so much against game(r)s? Sure, games can be violent. But games can also be informative,educational,sad but most of all fun. Just because few people kill themselfs because of a game. It doesn’t mean that those 10million other players in World of warcraft are going to kill someone or make an suicide. Ah well, thank god i don’t live in the US. Being Finnish we don’t have that much censorship bere. Kids can buy violent games all they want and that also includes movies. Kids can go to bar in a day time etc.. The funny thing is, even when our censorship is “weak” here. Murders committed are around 1-2 per year!
by: William
On January 27, 2008 at 3:08 am
Niko, the censorship attempts are really starting to get crazy over here in the states. Hopefully, something bigger than games will come along so they can jump on that bandwagon.
I spent a little time in Finland a long time ago. It did seem like people were really open minded and peaceful for the most part.
by: jAck Thompson, Tool at Large
On January 27, 2008 at 3:20 am
IM JACK THOMPSON AND I TALK LIKE A 12 YEAR OLD BOY.
Get over yourself, you retard. No one takes you seriously. You can’t hack real issues so you latch onto a soft science “link” between video games and bad human behavior?
News Flash jackass, there are about a million more important things in the world to fix besides your imaginary crusade against GAMES.
Someone with your position and power should be ashamed of using this as a stand to just get yourself attention. Make a difference for something that matters instead of flaunting your dick around the news. No ones gives a shit what you say. Really.
This probably isn’t even you, but hell I’ll post this anyway.
by: William
On January 27, 2008 at 3:36 am
You guys can believe it or not, but JT actually is a regular on this site from time to time. Of course, some of the comments are from fakes.
by: Blaine Knab
On January 27, 2008 at 6:45 am
Jack Thompson, Attorney says:
January 25th, 2008 at 8:30 am
Re parents being parents: Pay attention: The whole issue is whether stores should sell Mature games to kids when their parents are not there! I have a fifteen year old. I would be very upset if Best Buy sold GTA to my son without me there. Deal with it. That is the issue, not your silly fake issue of parental responsibility. We’re talking about corporate responsibility.
——-
So, what your saying is that you need a scapegoat for your inadequacies as a parent. Apparently Best Buy, and like retailers, have become the easy target for you. Furthermore, the issue of bad parenting is no silly issue at all. Games may, or may not, have an effect on children, but if you don’t know what’s going on in your childs life, you fail as a parent. Bottom line.
Also, why do you feel it necessary to come here and degrade people, calling them, “neanderthals,” and, “e-tards.” If you want to be a credible figure, at least fake some level of respect for your opposition.
by: MasterChief14
On January 27, 2008 at 10:08 am
Who cares if the real jack Thompson does visit the site or not. Seems like the thing he is being famous for is being a 1st class jackass.
by: Jack Thompson, Attorney
On January 27, 2008 at 3:40 pm
disregard that I suck cocks.
by: Person with an opinion
On January 27, 2008 at 5:40 pm
The real problem isn’t that video games are corrupting children; it’s that parents don’t care about what their children do. You can blame aggressive nature and bad parenting for the VA Tech shooting, but you can’t blame counterstrike. Even if counterstrike were not around, the angry and antisocial people who play it today would still be aggressive and antisocial. It would be ridiculous to refuse to believe that Cho played shooting games because he was an angry unstable person, and not that shooting games made him that way. I play WoW and counterstrike, and I’m quite certain I don’t feel any aggressive murderous towards society.
Is it so hard to believe that unstable people like Cho are drawn to games that let them vent their mad feelings like FPS’s. Violent video games can enhance aggressiveness I suppose, but they can’t cause it. It is logical that people who want to kill other people will play games in which they can kill other people. It isn’t logical that games in which you kill people instill an urgency to kill other people.
by: William
On January 27, 2008 at 7:08 pm
Well said Person with an opinion. Parents really need to be educated and make better decisions. I took my wife to the movies Saturday night to see Rambo.. and if any of you haven’t seen Rambo yet, it’s far bloodier and graphic than the originals. What shocked me was the number of young children in the theatre accompanying their parents. There was 2 infants, at least 3 or 4 kids in the 5-8 range and several that I would assume were around 13-15.
It blew my mind that parents are being that careless. I don’t think anyone should blame Rambo or the movie.. it’s simply stupid parents that are not taking care of their kids. I think when it comes to television and video games, some parents use them as a babysitter or to just get the kids out of their way.
by: Yo
On January 27, 2008 at 9:20 pm
tl;td
by: Azzmatazz
On January 27, 2008 at 10:26 pm
I will be flamed for this…
Video games are not to blame for this incident, or any other, where a life was ended. This is truly tragic. It really is. But lets say what others won’t. And that it is not the game, but them. THEM! The person who ends their life, because of depression, however sad. Has nothing to do with the game itself. The person who ends their life, because they are turned down by another player, or not accepted in a game. Seriously, has problems.
If you dont understand what I am saying.. condider this
Player 1: Hey we should be girlfriend/boyfriend
Player 2: No lol
Player 1: That makes me sad
” The FBI is notified. Someone could have notified someone to check up on the player in question.
Now, the game or gaming industry is not to blame when someone kills themself, or kills others. The only person to blame is the person who takes such drastic measures. As for social blame, you want to blame someone.. Blame the way they lived. If a person lets a game, become real life, then something in real life, has their self esteem so low. That their image in a game becomes more important. If something sad happens to their character, then they are sad in real life. Maybe they arent popular in school. Maybe they aren’t loved, or wern’t loved enough by family, and friends.. Who knows. But placing blame on a fictional game, is like saying someone who watches a movie about street racing. Then goes out in their car, tries to race. Fails at doing so. Causes an accident, killing a family if 4. Husband, mother, 2 year old girl, and 5 year old boy. Isn’t to blame. But the movie, infact… the actor who played the character in a movie, that raced is to blame. Its flat out stupid. The only one to blame, is the dead.
Flame away
by: Andrei
On January 27, 2008 at 11:11 pm
Cyber Gaming and violent behavior.
Well this is an interesting concept right here. The connection between the violent games and violent behaviour in real life. There is certainly a possibility of that. However saying that it is 100% necessarily caused by such is just childish. It’s like buying a packet of cigarettes and seeing a label on it that says “Smoking causes cancer”. Any lawyer should know that it’s a false statement. That statement implies a 100% inevitable result, but alas, my grandfather lived to the age of 90, smoking for 70 years of his life. He died of age – he did not have cancer. He isn’t the only one like that.
The exact same thing is applicable here. Violent games do not CAUSE violent behavior. They might result in such an action by a couple of kids that did not have proper parenting and failed to realise the difference between the game and real life. However, on the larger scale, violent games a source of venting out the anger and frustration, for a lot of us. After a long day at work… coming home and feeling like killing someone… APA somehow fails to notice that fact. APA somehow fails to prove that violent games actually take the violent behaviour off the streets and put them into the cyberspace where noone actually gets hurt.
I would also like to pose another question. What exactly did APA prove? That violent games cause violent behavior? Or that people with violent behavior buy violent games? It’s the same thing as global warming. The entire world is going on about third world emitting too much carbon dioxide and how they should be penalized for it. The biggest joke of it all is: global warming causes the increase in the carbon dioxide levels. Not the other way around as media likes to assume. If you have no idea what i’s talking about – off you go to do a lot of reading.
Lastly, i would like to have a reference to the works published by APA that have proven that gaming causes violent behavior or any of such conclusions.
P.S. I have been heavily involved in the gaming industry since 1994. 14 years of work in this field. I have done a number of seminars, consultations for parents, etc. The one thing i’ve learned is – like french like to say: “A glass of vine over dinner is good for health” whilst others like to say “drunk driving kills”. Both are true. In certain circumstances. Unless you’re a monkey in a zoo – it’s up to you to choose your circumstances.
by: Conner Schoenrock
On January 28, 2008 at 12:07 am
i fully support the idea the games should be regulated but not by the gov. it is the parents duties to control what and what not there kids should play. now im a aspireing game designier and yes i have some pretty graffic game ideas but under no means do i want a kid to be exposed to this stuff. but under no means i don’t want the gov. to tell me what i can or can’t put in the games.
by: chinaxshop
On January 28, 2008 at 12:20 am
if i didnt play video games i would have been sent to prison by now as i would not have found an adequate source to relieve my violent tendencies yes i agree video games can be linked to changes in peoples behaviour but only if there is other factors involved you can not guarantee if someone plays video games they will go out and kill people if that were the case lawyers would all be dead by now as most people hate them for one reason or another and since your alive typing your messages id assume thats not the case
by: Vtech00
On January 28, 2008 at 2:56 am
Re: All of this ‘evidence’ that violent video games has a causal and direct effect on outward violent behavior.
It’s not substantiated. I congratulate our lawyer friend for reading his APA journals which may support his argument on the surface, but you can find just as many journals through the APA showing NO direct evidence found linking the playing of violent video games and their violent behavior. I’m a Virginia Tech graduate, with a degree in Psychology (also interned at APA myself), and part of my studies in Blacksburg included a field study research project on response in children based on perceived aggression by ‘another child’ playing a video game against them. In reality it was a pre-programed computer simulation which allowed us to record heart rate, skin conductance and chemical analysis of saliva throughout the process. The results were that (as Mr. Thompson says) there was an elevation in physiological body responses that are similar to those found during Fight or Flight situations and sometimes during aggressive states. What we also found during post-interviews with parents and the children themselves is that the responses were entirely gone shortly after completion of the simulation and they showed no aggressive tendencies beyond their initial states before the experiment took place.
So what does this mean? What it means is that, first and foremost, this was an experiment in a lab with a selected group of people… which makes it very difficult to extrapolate to the general population. Very much like most research done in Psychology and likely very similar to what Mr. Thompson read and now dictates as “fact”.
It also means that people naturally get excitable and aggressive in a situation designed to make them aggressive… such as a video game that involves fighting/killing etc.
What it DOES NOT mean is that the game leads to a longterm change in behavior, an increase in violence actions to any greater degree than say watching any TV show with action scenes, or even our super heroes beating up bad guys.
If you want to use studies and statistics how about trying this out. Recently World of Warcraft released a statistic saying that they now have 10 million subscribers in the United States alone. 10 MILLION. If we are to believe Mr. Thompson then we had better board up the windows and lock the doors.. we are gonna have Armageddon on our hands. Even if it were a clear case that the game influenced the boy to take his own life, that would be a singular case out of millions and millions of people. NOT STATISTICALLY SIGNIFICANT. Straight up invalid. We call this an outlier in statistics. Its an extreme case that is very difficult to reproduce and is possible erroneous.
Its your responsibility as a lawyer to build a case around fact, not take studies and bend them towards whatever motivations you might have for censorship. Read a book. Heck, read two. Get your facts straight and instead of placing blame on the games lets start looking at the people’s personal history, family life, and biology.
by: Wowplayer
On January 28, 2008 at 4:57 am
He played a Warlock on the Illidan realm. He was fairly popular in the realm’s community.
Less than 6 months before his passing he fell in love online with a girl 4~ years younger than him – who also had issues surrounding suicide, and ‘online relationships’ which he was aware.
Take it for what you will.
by: Mat
On January 28, 2008 at 7:24 am
I play World of Warcraft, Counter Strike 1.5, 1.6 , Source, i have a Playstation2 and Playstation3 also an xbox 360 i have played games for more than 10 years and some of the most violent games… i havent killed anyone to date in real life!!!
I have a Girl friend soon to be married i have 2 children who watch Power Rangers and Teenage mutant ninja turtles, my son’s play power rangers with swords we got them for christmas.
Myself and mY girlfriend watched SAW4 the movie last night. A sick movie with a great story but there was no need for gore!!
My point
do i fit the Psycy of a Homicidal Maniac because i play games?
will my sons grow up Fighting Evil becuase that watch power rangers?
will My Girlfriend Tie me up and play a brutal life/death game?
Hardly…
I have experience with helping People in the gaming community that have “Real Life Problems”
by: Xiong Shoji
On January 28, 2008 at 9:47 am
I think William for bringing this well structured insight to this poor mans death. Reading some comments on this page is well sickening at best. Suicide is hardly a “violent crime” caused by a “violent game”, this person was obviously sick and needed help.
Isolation and Depression is a common place among many Asian Americans today. What others fail to see is… our English skill aren’t always up to par, or can not relate to white people in general. Which causes a venerable state of being which is easily tampered with.
Many factor’s can come into play here, However i will list the main one. How we were raised to show respect to out peers and family. When we fail to have a big social standing in our community, to more traditional parents we ourself our failures. (this is most true for hmong’s) This leads to depression which is hand in hand with isolation. Common red flag’s in any suicide.
I thank you William for you insight and touching personality, Also to all who have brought the modern day psycho “cho seung hui” into this… It’s totally unrelated to this matter. So keep on topic.
by: William
On January 28, 2008 at 9:58 am
@Xiong Shoji: Thanks for the comment. I think you are right that depression among Asian Americans (as well as other ethnic groups) has a lot to do with social issues. I’ve been on numerous college campuses in my time and have noticed that it may be more difficult for Asian students to completely mix in with the atmosphere. I think you can say similar things about African Americans. Even though the situation is different, we certainly have some cultural and social issues in this country. America is not exactly the easiest place to become a part of.
by: Xiong Shoji
On January 28, 2008 at 10:14 am
I was speaking for Daniel Kim as an Asian American myself, but true this go’s for everyone.
by: Laef
On January 28, 2008 at 12:11 pm
I’m gay, and a gamer.
When the Christian right bash gay people, they say do not trust APA. But now that they are bashing gamers, they quote APA like quoting the bible. So to all Chrisitian right like Jack Thompson – can you make up your mind, between gays and gamers, who do you hate more?
Has there been any study to establish the causal link between religious right and bigotry?
by: GG
On January 28, 2008 at 1:13 pm
I would just like say to you Jack Thompson that video games don’t make me angry, people like you do. By the way, how about instead of blaming video games on every issue in the world, you try and look at more serious issues like guns in America and your screwed up political leaders who do like to go and kill thousands of innocent people. Quickly blame video games! I personally do play alot of video games, why? Because I enjoy it, and im not suicidal, violent, or aggressive. Perhaps you should step back and take a look at a bigger issue, which is the current state your country is in all together…
R.I.P. Daniel
by: Honken
On January 28, 2008 at 1:35 pm
Oh yeah, all your sciene stuff Jack. How can people blame video games for killings? I’ve been a gamer all my life and have I ever felt an urge to go kill people? No, never. Have I ever wanted to hit people after playing GTA-ish games? No. Have you ever looked at TV, and seen american movies there?
If you want to blame something then you should blame your goverment for having laws that LEGALLY allow you to own fireams. How often does video game “rage” happen compared to gangfights and robberies where people get killed. English is not my first language, so dont smack on me for my english please.
by: William
On January 28, 2008 at 1:42 pm
To be honest, firearm ownership isn’t really an issue. Violence in America isn’t really that big of an issue right now, but many in the media would like us to think so. Look up the homicide rates.. they’ve been declining since the 70s when it was truly a violent nation.
When it comes to problems in this country, the things I am worried about is the fact that we are losing our constitutional rights and also the fact that we have leaders who start wars illegally killing hundreds of thousands of people. That’s what I call a problem with violence.
by: William
On January 28, 2008 at 1:45 pm
not to mention, there are just so many things we should be worried about. We have an infant mortality rate that’s on par with 3rd world nations and somehow that’s not a big deal.
by: EmptyK
On January 28, 2008 at 1:50 pm
I’ve met Dan a few times. His family runs a shop in Washington, DC and he and his sister would run the till occasionally. He seemed (outwardly) like a bright, happy guy… I would have never guessed he was in so much pain.
I’ve heard of no one actually blaming Dan’s gaming for his suicide. The only controversy I’ve heard attached to it is the fact that VT was given a red flag (emails from Daniel’s guild-mates,) and he still didn’t get the help he needed.
My thoughts go out to his family. They’re still in a great deal of pain.
by: Jack Thompson, Attorney
On January 28, 2008 at 3:19 pm
Stop replying. You are talking to a troll.
by: William
On January 28, 2008 at 3:26 pm
@EmptyK: the red flags sent to VT are still a bit of a debate around the campus. The real trick is that no one these days takes responsibility. He lived off campus, so the university acted like it was the town’s problem. And the town tends to act like students are the university’s problem.
I just wish people would just take action these days and not pass the responsibility so often.
by: Simon
On January 28, 2008 at 7:27 pm
Yea… I heard about this guy that read some posts by an attorney claiming that all video gamers are mad, and then IMMEDIATLY he went down the street and shot everyone, because that attorney made him furious…
by: Tiens
On January 28, 2008 at 8:33 pm
You know, if you were to get to the root of all of this, video games wouldn’t be to blame. But this whole rotten world would be, most people nowadays only live and care for theirselves and it’s a good enough reason to kill yourself if you care more about others than yourself, because caring for another doesn’t get you anywhere anymore. Simply loving and caring doesn’t cut it anymore, people want you to be the best of the best at whatever you do, heck even family pushes you to your limits in whatever you do. This world is a rotten place, and if ANYTHING is to blame for this, it’s all of you human beings who only care for theirselves.
by: somewhat
On January 28, 2008 at 8:35 pm
Looks like a red flag there Tiens !
by: OftenGamer
On January 28, 2008 at 10:40 pm
e-tard.. lol,
new word to be used in the gaming channels.
is there like AA meetings for gamers?
Hello i’m video game addict and i cant control myself.. i play video games and go beat up the old ppl and cops
by: Lets be rational
On January 29, 2008 at 12:16 am
As a professional scientist, I LOVE the fact that we have a lawyer (whose profession has only to gain with suits against wealthy gaming companies) citing a professional society of psychologists (who also have to gain by the creation of “causal links”). Whether you like it or not, psychology is even less statistically sound than general medicine. General medicine at least has meaningful, measurable, objective variables and testable hypotheses. Psychology of individuals lacks these quantifiable parameters, in all but the most mundane of measurements. To then extrapolate from a set of such parameters to population is nothing short of mathematical chicanery. To then take the next step, and say that any such “evidence” constitutes “an irrefutable causal link” (something that is actually quite rare in science, even in fields that actually use scientific method as classically defined), is, quite frankly, ridiculous. Just because you say it is so, doesn’t make it true. Just because a professional society of scientists says its so, also doesn’t make it true, particularly when they have a vested interest in the outcome.
You will of course argue that gamers have a vested interest in not believing such “links”. But given that these people ACTUALLY know large groups of fellow gamers, none of whom have committed such sad and desperate acts of violence, its not hard to see their point of view. Of course this is anecdotal evidence. But thats all you lawyers really care about anyway, isn’t it?
by: Rick
On January 29, 2008 at 1:15 am
I guess the real Jack Thompson is too much of a coward to show his face on here again. Whatever. He can lick a dick.
by: weclock
On January 29, 2008 at 2:13 am
Rick, that was a fakey fake.
but he said if you leave him a comment on
http://www.internetisseriousbusiness.com
he’d reply to it imperson and give you a signed apology.
by: Anonymous
On January 29, 2008 at 2:51 am
Jack Thompson said, “As a Christian…” well enough said in my book, now I know why he’s on these pages ranting and raving.
I pity him.
by: Eugene
On January 29, 2008 at 4:24 am
I’m a little late to this thread, but how do the “APA studies” prove a causal link between agression and violent video games? Looking through the one available paper, http://www.apa.org/journals/features/psp784772.pdf, I fail to see where playing violent video games “creates” an agression personality is proven. The majority of results indicate that at best violent video games “primes” an already aggressive personality for agressive behavior. They also show that exposure to violent video games does not lead to aggressive behavior for those with non-agressive personalities.
In the text, the authors specifically state the study is cross-sectional and not longitudinal, so they cannot directly prove that playing violent video games creates an agression personality. The authors to propose a model by which such a case could occur, but its not directly studied nor proven in this or any other cited work in APA press releases. That’s not to say the possibility isn’t disturbing and unworthy of further study, but I don’t think you can point to this particular APA study as proof of a causal relation.
I could only find press releases by APA regarding other works, but they all seem to uniformly suggest that playing violent video games HEIGHTENS agressiveness. They do state that due to the repetitive and learning nature of video games, violent video games COULD and MIGHT cause a shift in personality to agressive behavior but that longitudinal studies would be required. If in fact the APA is suggesting otherwise, it would be a disservice to the published research to deliberately misstate the nature of those studies.
Unfortunately, as someone whose studying for a PhD, its disheartening to see scientific work being overstated and misinterpted. I would also suggest the distinction between “APA studies” and studies published in the APA journal is cruical. I think its much more effective to promote something actually from the APA, such as http://www.apa.org/releases/resolutiononvideoviolence.pdf.
by: Dean Carter
On January 29, 2008 at 10:01 am
to jack thompson if you are reading. your ideas are crap. video games dont force people to go out and kill someone, the person makes that choice THEMSELF. i dont know if you realise this but people have been killing each other long before video games where invented. you need to look at the other factors that lead to someone becoming a killer. get that in your fucking head you peice of communist shit. you dont like it, send me to guantanemo bay or whatever i dont give a fuck.
by: William
On January 29, 2008 at 10:32 am
Eugene,
People are just twisting research results to fit their agendas. There is not one single scientific study in existence that shows a causal link between video games and violence. I’ve spent a lot of time searching for one online and in journals at the university library. I’ve even talked to psychologists and sociologists about the topic. The problem is that many people in the public are taking the word of special interest lawyers and not actually reading the studies on their own.
by: Mr big
On January 29, 2008 at 10:41 am
I just think Jack is tired of getting ROFlstomped in his gaming.
Go back to chasing ambulences and sueing doctors and stuff.
Your comrades are screwing more of the middle and lower class than any video game ever has or ever will.
Maybe u can drop some lawsuits on the gamemakers, run the cost of the games up, suck more from the middle and lower class.
The possiblities are endless
bah what a great profession ur in, u probly need a couple weeks off at ur 2nd or 3rd home.
by: Bob
On January 29, 2008 at 10:56 am
Ban violent video games and it wouldn’t take much to imagine an increase of violence, specifically on the lawmakers that are responsible.
by: gamer
On January 29, 2008 at 11:10 am
Wow, all of you take this really too seriosly, yes kids are dieing, but did you ever think that its because they have horrable lives outside of the game? They most likly kill themselves because they only have friends in a game, and at some point they see this and look at how bad their life really is. Next thing you know, once you get games out of the way, you are going to go after violent movies and try to screw them over. I play world of warcraft my self and I have a great fully funcional life, I also play mature rated games and I am only 15. I have a girl friend, lots of other friends, I’m in the band, paintball is a great passion of mine, and I don’t think that games do anything to me. The people who are killing themselves have none of that, they just play video games all the time.
by: William
On January 29, 2008 at 11:30 am
@gamer: living a well-rounded life is the key to being happy. Sounds like you are doing the right things.
by: t3h_uberpwnage
On January 29, 2008 at 4:28 pm
I have to say, WoW has become a trully much too addicting game to the teenage culture. I do play my own share of games, but never would I think of suicide. I avoid WoW and advise all my friends to do so too. In Korea, there was recently a new camp to nudge kids towards a less gaming life, to avoid these such tragedies. These camps should be found everywhere in the world where this kind of incident may happen. It is truly sad and grieves me to hear of another death because of specifically WoW.
by: Blev
On January 29, 2008 at 6:56 pm
I guess kids that don’t play video games, don’t commit adulty, drink, do drugs, jerk off/flip the little man in the boat, never held a gun, never told a lie, didn’t commit suicide bombings, didn’t flunk out of school, didn’t live in a poverty stricken society, didn’t forget to wash their hands after shooting american soldiers that were trying to save some of their towelhead family members……….
Shall I go on?
People either have it in them to kill or they don’t. Video games, as mentioned before, are yet another thing to blame shit on. You might want to blame it on the chemicals in the big mac he ate, or the caffine in the soda he drank, or perhaps the newspaper he was reading.
Was he sitting at his computer when he shot himself? No.
Chances are he had some time between gaming and the moment he pulled the trigger. There might have been a few things in that time thatdistracted his mind from gaming…you think?
You’re probably right, it’s all the video games fault.
by: Jack (not thompson)
On January 29, 2008 at 7:17 pm
Religion is many times more likely to provoke violence than any video game.
Because ultra-conservative religionists like you Jack Thompson, believe the story is real, and often the story is violent (from the Bible don’t you remember all the smiting God does?).
No Video Game actually believes video game story lines and characters or their motiviations are real.
Hundreds of milliions of people have died to idealogues like you Jack.
Whether it be the Christians during the Inquisition period of Europe, the radical muslims, the Communists, the Facists, or others who take their idealogies seriously.
Maybe we should ban Religious Scriptures from being sold in the stores.
by: Wayne
On January 29, 2008 at 7:40 pm
jack thompson, if a kid murders someone you cant just blame it on violent video games. you seem to think that banning violent video games will magicaly solve all these problems, well your living in a dream world. as someone metioned before you need to look into the deeper issues that caused it. maybe the kid came from a broken home in a deprived and violent neighborhood. obviously this child would see a lot of violent things happening, he would grow up thinking that it is acceptable behavior. kids need to be taught from an early age what is right and what is wrong. many parents dont do this and this is why kids end up as killers. it has little if any to do with videogames. as long as a someone knows right and wrong, violent games cant cause any harm
by: JACK THOMPSON
On January 29, 2008 at 11:28 pm
IM GAY
by: weclock
On January 30, 2008 at 12:10 am
Jack Thompson isn’t here.. you fools have been fooled, royally.
by: Ryan the Gamer
On January 30, 2008 at 4:45 am
I think he gave up entirely.
by: Sam
On January 30, 2008 at 4:42 pm
The sale of games rated “Mature” to minors is simply a by product of the production and creation of “Mature” games. Even if the sale of these games to minors didn’t exist, one would be a fool to assume that minors would never get their hands on a “Mature” game–in fact, I’m willing to bet (no hard evidence)that if one were to analyze and research how children obtained “Mature” games the leading cause would NOT be purchasing the game. Friends loan each other games, kids go the video rental store and pick out a game, etc.
Worrying over the content of a video game is a colossal waste of time anyway. If somebody wants something bad enough they will find a way to obtain it–that is the beauty of today’s world. Also, there are things aired on basic cable that are far more offensive and potentially mentally corrosive than “Mature” video games.
People can try to hide and avoid the real world all they want but in the end the only thing they are avoiding is the truth and they are ultimately hurting themselves. To keep children sheltered and in a “bubble” is to effectively lie to them. When they leave your household to pursue their own lives they will have to cope and deal with the real world–that is, a world full of corruption and immoral practices. Just because you raise your children as if these things don’t exist doesn’t protect them from these forces when they are on their own.
Parents are to prepare their children for life on their own. This is not to say that I would advocate purchasing “Mature” games or other “illicit” material for children just for the sake of introducing children to corruption and immorality,; however, I am saying that it is a very weak justification for preventing your child from playing a game that they want to. These wants and urges will be present in your children when they leave your nest because avoidance is NOT a means of closure–sheltering your children from simply not letting them obtain the “Mature” material they want is not going to make them not want it, it is only going to prolong their want which generally leads to an increase in interest.
Knowledge is power and true knowledge is experience.
by: lul
On January 30, 2008 at 7:34 pm
1)
Jack, your an idiot, you think your a lawer, yet you have the worst grammer ive ever seen
2)
Jack, your an idiot
3)
GO play a game jack, then you’ll have a different opinion
4)
If ANYTHING games are more educational then school is, I learnt a shit load from BF Vietnam, and AOM, they are hisotically accurate games, and I learnt it from games, not school.
5)
Why are american’s so thick? and stupid?
by: dreaden 37
On January 30, 2008 at 8:34 pm
im sorry…but if anyone has the slightest idea that gaming made this guy off himself is wrong….there were deeper problems from the begining……everyone looks for a escape goat…and blames gamers and the games themselves…try looking at the person instead of the game….dont blame the industry for someone being screwed up blame…them or even the parents for not doing a better job of raising them……..
by: Coren
On January 31, 2008 at 3:38 pm
Some guy here in Holland just a few months ago stepped into the train station and chopped of the head of someone (Im not kidding btw). Probably played too much games too. Oh wait, nope, we’re not in the US or Korea. Also, people in this country know not to put their cat in the microwave to dry them and we really, really like our coffee hot and if you spill it, you’re just stupid.
And just a few weeks ago a few children that live in my block (in a pretty good neighbourhood with “normal” working people) were playing with firecrackers all the long live day. At the age of about 4 nonetheless. With a lighter. Those same children were also playing in an open window on the first floor and always, always sit in front of the TV at 7 in the morning… Who shall we blame?
And about APA and causality and such: science doesn’t prove anything, science correlates and tries to show (based on theories) some relation between X and Y. In no way can science ever prove (by doing empirical studies) a hard and fast relationship between two variables. And if playing videogames “makes” someone aggressive then, by anology, so do movies, Marilyn Manson, Donald Duck and the Bible as they all “advocate” violence.
Two things I agree on though: 1) don’t sell M-rated games to kids and 2) playing a video game when you are already feeling lonely/misunderstood might just catalyze that feeling because when you turn of the computer, cold harsh reality kicks in a bit harder I guess.
Anyway, rant off. I get pretty piqued when I read these kind of things.
by: DeadMeat
On February 1, 2008 at 9:18 pm
Common sense ftw.
How many crimes have been commited like this with connection to video games
I can count them on my fucking hand.
Now, how many crimes have been commited with connection to drugs for instance
Or, how many people have been killed because of drink driving
How about plain old insanity
How about War
Conclusion: go cry about some other more serious factors than video games Jack Thompson, Attorney Faggot.
by: Lithius
On March 3, 2008 at 4:20 am
To any idiot to tries to tie violent video games to violence in reality…ur an idiot. I hate to bring this to your attention, but there are millions of ppl who play these games…and ya, some of them do these horrible things…but here’s a thought…ppl doing these horrible things happened long before violent video games.
Enough of this stupidity…ppl that does these things, will have done them without the video games…I have played every damn violent game made almost…and i have no inclination to kill ppl. It is the person’s fault for being a coward with their life, it is their parents faults…it is not a video games fault.
Now quit trying to blame it on games.
by: Common Sense
On March 17, 2008 at 5:17 pm
The simple fact of the matter here is that Jack Thompson is a lawyer. A self-glorified ambulance chaser. Every lawyer in the world is constantly looking for a new cause to champion. Why? To line their own pockets, that’s it. This is simply the current target this particular leech chose to pursue. Laugh at him and his petty kind like I do. Jack Thompson, you are a poor example of a human.
by: PackOfLlamas
On April 19, 2008 at 8:08 am
“Jack Thompson” sounds like a soccer mom
by: Jack Thompson is ***!
On October 25, 2008 at 9:07 am
Rofl, i’m almost laughing 2 death.. HE’S FREAKING TRYING 2 STOP THE WORLDS LARGEST COMMUNITY, 2 JUST FADE AWAY! Gaming is life! There are more than 20 million gamers out there! Jack Thompson, why don’t you play the game La**y? I’m sure some porn will fresh up you’r brain dead mind. Maybe it’ll even get rid of ur retardness
by: Shannon Ketchem
On December 2, 2011 at 5:26 am
When wull it be released in egypt ?
by: Radu
On January 9, 2012 at 12:25 pm
If there weren’t video games and violent movies to feed our natively need for violence… the society will most probably born again some kind of Nazi. There is no link between suicide and violence, and yes… the human being is a violent one, it’s an Universe issue.