Guss i'm the only one who knows what a navmesh is. -1 reply

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Lonely killer is....

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7th December 2005

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#1 12 years ago

Allright i see so many people asking q's about why maps don't have something. I know what this "navmesh" is but someone else try and explain what it is so i can prove that noone in BF files don't know what it is!!!:deal:




UGSAce

Webernet Law Enforcement

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26th July 2005

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#2 12 years ago

it was in one of the reviews i read on this site Dice said the reason they didnt make a 64 player map single player with bots is b/c it took like 5 days to make 1 map and it was only 32 player size and they said they were short on time so from wat i understood a navmesh is something to make the bots do wat tehy do best




Crazy Wolf VIP Member

Snipes With Artillery

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22nd March 2005

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#3 12 years ago

A navmesh: A 'mesh' laid over a map to tell bots where they can move. No one wants bots to wallhack, no do they?




apocalypse_kid

I would die without GF

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#4 12 years ago

Anybody who has created maps for just about any type of FPS knows that the bots have to have a guide to move around and to avoid areas that normal humans would, like the edge of bridges, buildings and etc. In old games like Quake/Q2/Q3 the guide was called pathmapping, a program was used to generate all the safe paths that a bot could take (sometimes it was even done manually by having the program follow a player model around), the computer would then use that to decide where the bots went in relation to the human players and etc. It was fairly simple for those games, the paths were through corridors and and always on foot, multilevelled of course, and still relatively small, an hour or two on a P3 would generate a good pathmap.

On BF2 of course there are paths that are safe for ppl on foot, in DPV's, Tanks, even amphibious vehicles, as well as air, choppers, jets and etc, and there are no corridors, just large open areas for the bots to run around in and objects marked as enemy points, friendly points etc.

Now the navmesh is exactly that, a mesh of guides that cover the map, that incorporates safe paths for bots walking, driving, swimming, boating (or both in amphibious vehicles) and this mesh has to take into account the fact that different vehicles have different capabilites and that bots on foot can get on top of buildings using ladders and etc, DPV's can drive upslopes that a tank can't, amphibious vehicles don't have to stick to bridges, but DO have to cross where the bank on the opposite side allows exit from the water, and not forgetting of course that the bridges are dynamic objects and can be destroyed.

This is not something that can be coded by hand. The old BF2 used greyscale maps for bot navigating, one map for each vehicle type and on foot, and a good coder with a few tools could generate a reasonably good greyscale map for the bots to use, not always perfectly, but it did the trick reasonably well.

It appears that BF2 has changed this method, and as a result the Navmesh requires a special tool to generate, and can take many days, even on a fast machine, for the large 64 player maps, that's why they only bothered with SP for the 16 player maps, they ran out of time to generate the Navmesh.

Now this won't stop the community mapmakers though. I can remember leaving my computer running solid for 3 days to generate Quake maps on my old P1, and since the Navmesh tool is being released with the next version of the editor expect a rush of single player and COOP maps (any COOP mod wil of course require the Navmesh tool, so don't expect any big COOP Mods until it is released)

Hope this helps!

AK

:smokin:




-J_B-

eh...

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#5 12 years ago

Apocolypse kid do you know when the next editor is being released??




apocalypse_kid

I would die without GF

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#6 12 years ago
We will be releasing the updated Mod Tool to a few individual Mod teams prior to getting it out to everyone else. This will be closely followed by a public release in a few weeks' time. We're really excited about being able to release this and look forward to seeing some great Mods out there.

This is the best I can do for now, from EA.

AK

:smokin:




Lonely killer is....

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#7 12 years ago
apocalypse_kidAnybody who has created maps for just about any type of FPS knows that the bots have to have a guide to move around and to avoid areas that normal humans would, like the edge of bridges, buildings and etc. In old games like Quake/Q2/Q3 the guide was called pathmapping, a program was used to generate all the safe paths that a bot could take (sometimes it was even done manually by having the program follow a player model around), the computer would then use that to decide where the bots went in relation to the human players and etc. It was fairly simple for those games, the paths were through corridors and and always on foot, multilevelled of course, and still relatively small, an hour or two on a P3 would generate a good pathmap. On BF2 of course there are paths that are safe for ppl on foot, in DPV's, Tanks, even amphibious vehicles, as well as air, choppers, jets and etc, and there are no corridors, just large open areas for the bots to run around in and objects marked as enemy points, friendly points etc. Now the navmesh is exactly that, a mesh of guides that cover the map, that incorporates safe paths for bots walking, driving, swimming, boating (or both in amphibious vehicles) and this mesh has to take into account the fact that different vehicles have different capabilites and that bots on foot can get on top of buildings using ladders and etc, DPV's can drive upslopes that a tank can't, amphibious vehicles don't have to stick to bridges, but DO have to cross where the bank on the opposite side allows exit from the water, and not forgetting of course that the bridges are dynamic objects and can be destroyed. This is not something that can be coded by hand. The old BF2 used greyscale maps for bot navigating, one map for each vehicle type and on foot, and a good coder with a few tools could generate a reasonably good greyscale map for the bots to use, not always perfectly, but it did the trick reasonably well. It appears that BF2 has changed this method, and as a result the Navmesh requires a special tool to generate, and can take many days, even on a fast machine, for the large 64 player maps, that's why they only bothered with SP for the 16 player maps, they ran out of time to generate the Navmesh. Now this won't stop the community mapmakers though. I can remember leaving my computer running solid for 3 days to generate Quake maps on my old P1, and since the Navmesh tool is being released with the next version of the editor expect a rush of single player and COOP maps (any COOP mod wil of course require the Navmesh tool, so don't expect any big COOP Mods until it is released) Hope this helps! AK :smokin:

Jesus!!! I can't belive that other people outside of the BF:SP community knows what this is!!! :eek:




Lonely killer is....

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#8 12 years ago
-J_B-Apocolypse kid do you know when the next editor is being released??

I know when it's going to be released: 1/12/06 Hope this helps:cya: Looking foward to putting bots on maps.:bows:




Lonely killer is....

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#9 12 years ago
UGSAceit was in one of the reviews i read on this site Dice said the reason they didnt make a 64 player map single player with bots is b/c it took like 5 days to make 1 map and it was only 32 player size and they said they were short on time so from wat i understood a navmesh is something to make the bots do wat tehy do best

I think that dice made up about the stuff being 5 days to make a 16 player sized map they might be useing a 1.3 ghz harddrive computer for all we know.:lol: But the BF:SP community will work hard to bring SP support to the maps and you can count on that.:beer: :smokin:




-J_B-

eh...

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#10 12 years ago

Awesome!