Lets kick up some more dust : Sherman vs Tiger -1 reply

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the_move

Frisch, Fromm, Fröhlich, Frei!

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28th September 2003

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#51 16 years ago

YAWN!!!

I do not see any sense in all this arguing.

The Tigerfibel just gives another proof that the Tiger has a big advantage over Sherman and T34. Just do not let the enemy come into firing range and your just fine!

"Tiger I was armed with powerful 88mm gun (originally developed from 88mm Flak 36 L/56 gun) that made it a very dangerous opponent for any Allied tank, and its thick (but not shot deflecting) armor made it virtually indestructible. Both Sherman with 76mm gun and T-34/85 stood a chance against Tiger only at close range. It is reported that in July of 1944, commander of 3rd company of schwere Panzer Abteilung 506, Captain Wakker, destroyed Soviet T-34 at the range of 3900 meters. The rule applied by the British concerning the engagement of Tigers was that five Shermans were needed to destroy a single Tiger, but only one Sherman was to return from the engagement. Tiger's only weak spot was its rear armor plate and its engine, which required continuous maintenance. During their combat service, Tigers destroyed large numbers of enemy tanks and other equipment, creating the myth of their invincibility and fearsome power - "Tiger-phobia". Tiger also had tremendous effect on morale of both German and Allied soldiers, German felt secure, while Allies thought that every German tank, especially late model PzKpfw IV was a Tiger ! "...and the T-34s and KVs eliminated hundreds of Tigers...", Russian Newspaper Article about Battle of Kursk, Novosti Press Agency, 1943.

Original 250 Tigers were powered by 12-cylinder Maybach HL 210 P 45 engine with total power of 650hp, which made Tiger badly underpowered and its off-road performance suffered as a result. To improve that problem modified 12-cylinder Maybach HL 230 P 45 engine with power increased to 700hp was installed in all models since May of 1943. The sound of the Tiger engine starting had a distinctive noise even at the distance and was well known to the Allied soldiers, who remember it with respect.

The first 500 (495) Tigers were equipped with a snorkelling device allowing them to travel underwater as deep as 4-5 meters for 2.5 hours. Later models were provided with wading equipment allowing them to travel underwater only as deep as 1.3 meters. Tigers produced from November 1942 to August 1943 were fitted with full tropical air filter 'Feifel' system."[B]

http://www.achtungpanzer.com/tiger.htm

I don´t give a shit if you want the devs to make the Tiger weaker than the Sherman or T-34 in FH you must be really dumb. How bout learning to use a dive bomber?!




the_move

Frisch, Fromm, Fröhlich, Frei!

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28th September 2003

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#52 16 years ago

CoolguyThe Sherman is in my oppinion vastly superior to the T-34.

A few facts:

- Russian crews preferred them over T-34s. - They kicked T-34s ass in Korea (yes, Shermans) - Untill the early 1970s the Shermans were still the MBT of Israel and they pwned T-34/85s & IS-2s with them en masse. Hell they even pwned T-55s when upgunned!

But those Shermans used there were not the weaky M4s used mainly by the US in WWII (steel coffins).

Those were the enhanced versions with bigger guns, so at least try to distinquish!




emonkies

I'm too cool to Post

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#53 16 years ago

You will please note that I did not say the entire Italian Army fought well. As I posted earlier, an Army is only as good as its training and the men leading it.

I was trying to give you examples of facts that there were battles in which the Italians fought very well and earned some respect from their Allies and enemies alike. Unlike your example which gave the impression that ALL Italians were unable to organize an effective combat force.

I agree with you that the majority of the Italian Army was poorly equipped and poorly led.

Your statement of the Italians fighting well must be because they were trapped because they were incapable otherwise.

You seem unwilling to accept that there were Italian units that could fight well. History says otherwise.

BTW I am not Italian. I just hate prejudice.