Mortain -1 reply

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Guest

I didn't make it!

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#1 10 years ago

The following image is from the website and depicts the 3rd Armored against the 2nd Panzers:

minimap.jpg

Now yes... the 3rd Armored Division was there... but it was mainly the actions of the 30th Infantry Division that stalled the counterattack of the Germans in the battle I'm guessing you're using here.

Also, keep in mind that the 2nd Armored Division was also there with elements of a number of Infantry Divisions that also helped in the attack/counterattack:

Co. H., 41st Armored Infantry Regiment held a hill east of Mortain for five rugged days and nights, driving back repeated enemy counterattacks

That regiment was in the 2nd Armored Division. I think you should take that map and instead of just putting the 3rd on there... add in the different elements that were also present. If in the end you decide that in the team selection that it's the 3rd Armored for Allies... so be it. I still think the 30th Infantry Division would make more sense there though being the primary force:

This small French village became the focus of a German counterattack on the evening of August 6, 1944. Operation Lüttich, as it was called, was ordered by Hitler with the intention of splitting the American forces between Hodges' First Army and Patton's newly formed Third Army. The Germans needed control of the vital road network around Mortain to allow a drive to Avranches on the coast. the Germans would later state that their failure to complete the separation of the American forces was a "turning point" in the battle of the western front. This failure was caused by the determined resistance of Old Hickory at Mortain. Hitler personally ordered this attack contrary to the advice of his generals. It was opposed to such a degree that the commander of the116th Panzer Division refused to follow the order, delaying the attack. Nonetheless, at approximately 0100 hours 7 August the lead elements of the 2nd SS Panzer Division made contact with members of the 9th U.S. Infantry Division. In addition to the 2nd SS "Panzer Lehr" division, the 1st SS Panzer "Liebstandarte Adolf Hitler", 116th Panzer, and17th SS Panzergrenadier divisions also participated. The disposition of Old Hickory's troops around Mortain was as follows. On the eastern side of the town stood a tall hill, elevation 314. Hill 314 had been recognized by the Americans as a vital defensive position early on and was held by the 2nd battalion, 120th Infantry. The 1st of the 120th was on the west of Mortain holding hill 285. Two platoons of the 120th's company F, a platoon of the 120th's antitank company, along with 3rd platoon of Company A, 823rd Tank Destroyer Battalion had established what would prove to be a crucial roadblock at L'Abbaye Blanche where they could cover the road junctions north of Mortain. Meanwhile, the 117th Infantry was in place at St. Barthelmy, approximately two miles north of Mortain. The 119th Infantry was to the northwest near Le Mesnil-Adelée.

A nice little historical article on the battle can be found here:

Mortain: the Battle for Hill 314




azreal

FH2 Betatester

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15th July 2006

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#2 10 years ago

Does it really matter? I mean the US and German player models and vehicles are generic. They do not depict different divisions for each map, as this would take a lot of unnecessary work for something so insignificant. And besides, its just the name of a main base flag, so...who cares?




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#3 10 years ago

Well... this is a realism mod and they're making a map based on an actual battle... you would think they would want it accurate. So labeling the allied team as "3rd Armored Division" isn't giving recognition to the unit that was of the majority (the 30th Infantry Division).

Not only that... but no, not all skins should be generic. There's a half dozen different uniforms used at the time of this battle that making one plain Allied skin wouldn't do justice to.

Keep in mind in 1944 you had:

Paratroopers (to name just a few): -502nd -101st

Infantry Divisions: 1-106 (each with a unique patch on their uniform)

Armored Divisions: 1-14, 16, and 20 (each with a unique patch on their uniform)

Then to make matters worse... you have 3 different uniforms for each type of Division (though to simplify matters you basically had ONE Infantry and ONE paratrooper that was in the majority of use during 1944). Now should the Americans pop in during 1943 as they should in Italy... you can again go back to the different uniform options.

Anyway... I don't expect the mod team to craft out every uniform possibility (I'm hoping for at the very least your standard Infantry and Paratrooper models). But to make a ton of different models it would take too long and be counterproductive.

But if they're going to make a map where they label one side one particular unit, and the other side a specific unit... I would hope they'd give recognition where it's due. In my particular argument here, I think the fighting team should be the 30th ID.




Flyboy1942

A.K.A. Ghanrage

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29th January 2005

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#4 10 years ago

Something as minor as a name on the map will probably get changed if it needs to be. Thanks for bringing it up though.

While multiple player models would be wonderful, like you said it would also be extremely time consuming, and I would rather wait until a later release to get those than have them spend extra time right now.




Fenring

FH Dev

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30th November 2006

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#5 10 years ago

I will change the localization its very easy, thanks for the tip.




Guest

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#6 10 years ago
deathfromabove2010;4521252Does it really matter? I mean the US and German player models and vehicles are generic. They do not depict different divisions for each map, as this would take a lot of unnecessary work for something so insignificant. And besides, its just the name of a main base flag, so...who cares?

For a realism mod such as FH2? Yes it should be done. They changed this stuff map accordingly in Fh1. Extra work to add more realism would be worth it. If your gonna re-create a battle from ww2 its best to make sure everything is correct.

Also good information, Young [2nd AD].




Thamu

Brazil,presents in WW2

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5th May 2008

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#7 10 years ago
deathfromabove2010;4521252Does it really matter? I mean the US and German player models and vehicles are generic. They do not depict different divisions for each map, as this would take a lot of unnecessary work for something so insignificant. And besides, its just the name of a main base flag, so...who cares?

I think Young [2nd AD] is right.Is very good when you play with realism.




[130.Pz]W.Fuchs

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20th March 2008

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#8 10 years ago
'Young [2nd AD;4521272'] Paratroopers (to name just a few): -502nd -101st

502nd is a regiment of the 101st.




Von Mudra

Lo, I am Mudra, za emo soldat!

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25th September 2004

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#9 10 years ago

" 2nd SS "Panzer Lehr" division"

:O How dare they disgrace the good name of the 130th Panzer Lehr by naming the 2nd SS as the Panzer Lehr division. The 2nd SS was Das Reich, the 130th was Panzer Lehr.




[130.Pz]W.Fuchs

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#10 10 years ago

They just called us nazi's :uhm:




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