Undergrowth - The Vanishing Grass Trick -1 reply

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H.Moleman Esq.

Cubix82

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28th November 2006

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#1 10 years ago

Or "Get up, fool, I can see you a mile away"

Maybe you've seen this happening on the Sfakia map. You go prone in the grass, you can't see out properly and it seems like you're in cover. However, the enemy a little way off in the distance can see you well enough to shoot you because you're sitting in the open: for him, the grass surrounding you hasn't been rendered.

It's a known issue with the BF2 engine (and most other games). Undergrowth only gets rendered within a certain distance of you. If that setting gets pushed too high it sucks up too many resources, and as I understand it in FH2 it's already as high as it can go. The area around you looks pretty and lush and overgrown, but the same area from 100yds away looks like a freshly-cut football pitch. The bottom line is that this long grass that looks really nice and seems like it would be perfect for your squad to set up an ambush in.... it only exists in your imagination. The enemy can't see it.

Some people don't care. Some people hate it. Some people don't know it happens (they're the easy targets crawling about on the empty hillside thinking they're in cover, probably). Personally, I'm with the haters because it blocks your view and gives you the feeling that you're in cover when you're not, and is basically sucking up your FPS for no good reason.

So given that it can't be fixed, how are the mappers and devs going to be using it in future maps? We're in the desert at the moment so it's not a problem but Italy, France, Russia... Micronesia? There's a lot of long grass in those places. And cornfields, and brush, and bracken. Is this undergrowth stuff going to be painted all over the map, or used only in areas where the view distance won't be a problem, or maybe abandoned altogether for some other way of making ground cover that doesn't disappear?

Ideally the infantry needs plenty of undergrowth to crawl about in but if it's the magic pixie-grass kind that vanishes unexpectedly I'd rather go without.




LIGHTNING [NL]

FH2 Developer

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30th May 2003

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#2 10 years ago

There actually isn't a maximum viewing distance for undergrowth, but if you set it too high it will start lagging.

I'm not quite sure about the grass in future theaters, but I expect it to only be used as something that will make the map look better. Not grass in which you can actually hide.




foodmaniac2003

Gelato pwns all

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11th March 2006

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#3 10 years ago

I miss my 1942 grass :(

Is it possible that patches of grass could be modeled as statics? I don't mean each individual blade is a static, but large patches of it.




Archimonde0_0

In Vino Veritas

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28th August 2006

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#4 10 years ago

This is what i like to call: The Failure of a major game company to realize that not everyone has a super computer that can run your OMG so awesome graphics on all High settings problem. DICE and EA are just like any other gaming company, that expects you to have a super computer capable of running BF2 on high graphics straight out of the box, they take no effort in trying to increase the performance of the game. This can be seen especially in BF2 patch 1.41 where the lag is...rediculous compared to BF2's original versions. Seeing as how the grass offers you no advantage except of ranges less than point blank, if you have trouble running BF2 without constant lag...just remove it. The maps look no more of less better either way.




hockeywarrior2

A superior 5-digit number

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27th June 2004

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#5 10 years ago

I as well want to know whether or not you guys can make grass that is like a static mesh like in BF42 that wont' disappear. I remember EoD (Vietnam mod) for BF42 was better than the BFV version because the grass did not disappear.

There must be a way to produce some grass that isn't a sprite. Right?




General Tso

Head Chump

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30th September 2003

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#6 10 years ago
Archimonde0_0;4216445T DICE and EA are just like any other gaming company, that expects you to have a super computer capable of running BF2 on high graphics straight out of the box, they take no effort in trying to increase the performance of the game. This can be seen especially in BF2 patch 1.41 where the lag is...rediculous compared to BF2's original versions.

I want to know why BF2 ran better in 2005 when I had a Nvidia 6800GT and 1GB of RAM than it does now with a 7800GS and 1.5GB of RAM.

:uhoh:




Archimonde0_0

In Vino Veritas

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28th August 2006

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#7 10 years ago

Trust me, it was the Patches




Kubador

First in Hell

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19th November 2007

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#8 10 years ago

There are still those little bushes that don't dissapear (ex: at Sidi and Hiacynth). Unfortunately there arent many if any much around sfakia.




Fenring

FH Dev

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30th November 2006

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#9 10 years ago

Some of the bushes is overgrowth which has a render distance almost the same as the fog/viewdistance, thats why you can hide behind the bushes in el alamein and sidi but not in the grass at sfakia. Sfakia has a practical viewdistance of 250 and el alamein 600 , so if you cant have a totally rendered overgrowth in 250 you maybe has to go as low as 125 to make it playable and it wont look that good. Also you can easily turn of the undergrowth and exploiters will have a field day.

So if youre gonna hide, hide behind the large bushes or trees. As for the decreased bf2 performance, it seems the longer existing DICE canada screwed up the game in a epic way.




H.Moleman Esq.

Cubix82

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28th November 2006

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#10 10 years ago
'LIGHTNING [NL;4216343']I'm not quite sure about the grass in future theaters, but I expect it to only be used as something that will make the map look better. Not grass in which you can actually hide.[/quote] If the undergrowth is just ground covering (like short grass, flowers, small rocks etc.) that improves the look of the map that's OK. But what we've got in Sfakia is stuff that looks good but hinders you. You're running through it and someone shoots at you, so you drop prone and it feels like you're in cover: you can't see out properly to shoot back, the grass is up over your head so you feel like you're hidden, but you have to keep telling yourself that it's not really there. That spoils the game a little for me.

'hockeywarrior2'I as well want to know whether or not you guys can make grass that is like a static mesh like in BF42 that wont' disappear. I remember EoD (Vietnam mod) for BF42 was better than the BFV version because the grass did not disappear.

There must be a way to produce some grass that isn't a sprite. Right?

[quote='foodmaniac2003']I miss my 1942 grass sad%20%28frown%29.gif Is it possible that patches of grass could be modeled as statics? I don't mean each individual blade is a static, but large patches of it.

That's what I'm hoping for. Ditch the undergrowth altogether (or just use it in a subtle way to add texture to the ground around the player that people with lower-end PCs can turn off) and maybe model clumps of long grass etc. as overgrowth. We need more cover than the occasional bush or tree, but this stuff doesn't do the job (well it does, but only if you and the enemy are within a few feet of each other, and the other guy hasn't got his settings on minimum).