Ok Killor, here we have our own nice little thread for an argument about guns :) Others are of course invited to join us :) But let's try to keep it civil. The last thing I posted in the other thread (sorry for derailing it) was
"If criminals knew that you don't have a gun they probably wouldn't first shoot you and then take the wallet but just ask you to hand it over. Even a criminal can figure that robbing a person get's him less years in jail than shooting a person. Where I live it's rather hard (even for criminals) to come by automatic weapons. As cop I would be rather nervous if I knew that every little scoundrel has an automatic weapon up his sleeve. And just because there was no accident because of firearms in your family it doesn't mean that applies to all families, or other generations of your family."
Oh, and I also wondered if you could explain what you meant with "Germany's current state"(in your answer to Zollhund).
The cream of the crop
19th August 2003
i believe everyone has a right to own a gun. (contitution)
and just like with everything, there will be people who abuse this power and choice/privilage. but thats the risk you take.
i personally want to own tons of weapons. its in my blood, and i like shooting targets. and it is also good incase you need some serious self-defence.
but whatever, people will always dissagree with other people owning guns.... thanks to the media and stupid oppinions :uhoh:
EDIT: "Laws that forbid the carrying of arms... disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes... Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man." - Jefferson's "Commonplace Book," 1774-1776, quoting from On Crimes and Punishment, by criminologist Cesare Beccaria, 1764
EDIT: here is another --------> "I ask, sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people, except for a few public officials.'' "To disarm the people is the best and most effectual way to enslave them." - George Mason
need i say more? i think not.
I'm too cool to Post
17th September 2003
in the UK firearms are pretty much out-lawed and we have so much less gun crime than you guys do.
24th November 2002
The U.S. has the most gun violence compared to any other country in the world...
I don't see the point in owning a weapon for self-defense if criminals are not interested in killing you, but just in your money. I mean, what's the point of shooting someone who isn't armed, you will get the money either way, just if you dont shoot you wont go to jail for such a long time if they catch you. And even if you have a gun, let's say you get mugged on the street, would you rather give the criminal your money or take the chance and try to get your gun out faster than he can pull his trigger?
If you manage to get some severe restrictions for owning weapons(in all your states) then it wouldnt be so easy for criminals to buy weapons on black market(of course it would take quite a while until the amount of weapons on the market shrinks). Where do you think these weapons come from in the first place?
About constitution, maybe it's a good idea to have a militia just in case, but, as far as I can see it, in the USA the number of people getting killed by the sideeffects of such liberal restrictions for weapons doesn't exactly equal the number of defeated evil Britons, who want their colonies back.
Well, I obviously know more about your politics than you about mine if you call the German government socialist. And it's not too difficult to figure that a weapon from a black market once belonged to a person who legally bought it from a store/from such a store directly. And people here do posses weapons, actually I have some myself.
Saying "you dont know anything" is not an answer to my arguments, it just shows that you dont have any better arguments.
08'aIgnorance is not an excuse
28th November 2003
I agree with you MrFancyPants, but i think it's too late to to ban weapons in USA becasue all good citizens would give thier weapons away but the bad guys would keep thiers. IMO they should banned all weapons in the first place.
I never said I know much about much about America, just that I know more about America than you do about Germany. No offense meant, but you'd better grap a dictionary and look up socialism and then compare it to the present government we have here :) Ok, let's wait for your friends then if you ran out of ideas atm :)
Mast3r, you're probably right, but keeping the status quo can't be a solution, can it?
08'aIgnorance is not an excuse
28th November 2003
Well i dunno shit about american history but i guess that has something to do with indians...IMO they should banned guns around 1900 or someting, but as i said, it's to late now anyway.
KillorLiveRight, like during 1776 and 1812, we certainly shouldn't have had firearms then! "I do not love the sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for it's swiftness. I only love that which they defend."
I guess he meant not exactly that time.
Anyway, I think it's strange to compare present day automatic weapons to the state of the art firearm of 1776 :) If they'd written the constituion accordingly it would be like "it's not only your right to have a weapon at home, we hold it for selfevident that thou should have a whole stack of weapons! And several cannons."