JK2 dying. Could Padawan treatment be the problem? -1 reply

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Muun

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27th March 2003

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#21 16 years ago

Any chance of listing the names of those clans, to know whom to avoid? (Judging by their behavior, they sound like such "famous clans" as 'Myg0t', 'Teamgod', or 'Xtremely Lame Clowns'... though I so far didn't think those "clans" infected Jedi Knight 2 already :))




Mr. Matt VIP Member

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#22 16 years ago

Thanks for the positive complements, guys. And yes, I went to DJC a while ago and it seemed one of the more amicable servers out there, a good place for newbies, especially judging by Tyrannus' encouragement (lol, despite his shameless advertising :D).

Muun... I realise that listing those servers which were good and which were bad would help people avoid the bad ones, but as I said before, |DB| refuses to tarnish any clan's or administrator's reputation, no matter what they do. Lol, that would make us one of the few clans who have no mortal enemies. We merely brought the fact that padawan mistreatment is still going on to, despite projects to encourage new players, to everyone's attention. If someone else wants to conduct their own investigation and list the servers involved, then thats entirely their perrogative... It'll certainly keep admin on their toes if they read this :). Hopefully if those involved do read this, they may change their ways, but I'm well aware of how hard it is to change someone's opinion.

As for the popular clans I mentioned as being some of the worst, lets just say, these are some of the most prominant clans, league quality. They may well have gotten arrogant, and just forgotten or neglected a skilled clan's responsibility to a community. Like when people think of athletics, most (in Britain anyway) will immediately have thoughts of such greats as Linford Christie; when you think of JK2, you will think of these clans. And don't ask whether you've guessed right, I can't tell you. I may get people from major clans complaining at this generalisation, but remember, it is just to save me listing those involved. I'm sure you know who you are; if you treat padawans with respect, you obviously don't need to complain. I just hope that they will either change their ways, or a clan willing to expose them does so. Simply, the only way you can find out whether a server will treat you with respect or contempt is to try the water for yourself. Stay if you like, find somewhere else if you don't. The majority of servers out there, especially those average clans with servers who are in it simply for the fun or honor, prefer to help padawans, even if it for selfish reasons like making themselves feel superior by taking on a padawan. The day before yesterday I helped a padawan; even if you are in an intollerant server you may find help. But don't quit because of one bad egg.




CorT VIP Member

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2nd April 2003

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#23 16 years ago

i have never been treated poorly as a "n00b". i just wish i could remember wht server i went to....




peter north

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16th June 2003

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#24 16 years ago

I'm going to be civil about this but quite frankly this "code of honor" rubbish is what has hurt this game more than anything.

In case no one was paying attention, back when jk2 was a "fast and frenzy fps" (prior to the entire saber off = peace stuff) it had the largest player base.

Over time as more and more of these silly little "YOU LAMED ME!!!11" rules came into place more and more players (i.e. people who bought the game and wanted to *play it online, not stand around emoting and bowing) got fed up and left as these rules became more common.

I admit being a jerk online is one thing (racial slurs, sexist remarks, excessive profanity towards people who don't appreciate it) but some guy running up and kicking your 3 dimensional Jedi character is not going to emotionally scar you for life.

If you are just standing around doing nothing and two guys fighting accidentally kill you, or even kill you on purpose to get your body out of the way so they can fight is it really necessary to flip out and cry to the admin and have them slapped/banned?

Was occupying that space while doing nothing but staring off into oblivion that important?

Can’t you press the talk key just as easily from spec mode or another spawn point, or did you just have to be on “the duel pad” when you talk in message mode 1?

People talk about "noob abuse" well no one does it more than the "saber off = peace" crowd.

Think about it for a second.

Some kid gets jk2 for his birthday. He puts it in, connects to a server and wow look at all the stuff he can do.

Lightning, force powers all kinds of stuff.

Yeah right, less than two minutes into the game he's got 1/2 the server calling him a "lamer" and the other 1/2 trying to vote kick him.

He tries another server and he's got empowered admins beating the hell out of him or people putting him to sleep, standing over him and reading him the "Bible of jk2 honor".

Would you want to keep playing after all that crap?

I wouldn't.

I run a competitive ladder/league clan and server. Now sure we get "noobs" but you know what?

We may beat the hell out of them but we actually *let them play and they constantly comment how refreshing it is to just be able to connect to a server and play some jk2 with out having to ask for a written contract from another player just to have permission to swing a saber at them...

And one last thing, this whole "training" thing.

Look you want to get good; you don't have a "master” and you don't become anyone’s "apprentice" you simply connect to a server with people better than you and play.

Sure you will get owned at first but if you are serious about becoming good you have to surround yourself with the best and learn from your mistakes.

I can't comment on the European end, but as for the American players the absolute best in this game were never anyone’s "apprentice" they were simply people who played every chance they got against the top players at the time.

Not one of these people ever subscribed to the "saber off = peace" mentality, as a matter of fact most of them don't even play on servers with "codes of honor" nor have they ever.

Why? Because on those servers people *never play.

Going through 4 map rotations with 16 players and no one ever scoring over 4 frags in the span of 80 minutes is going to make for some very weakly skilled players to say the least.




Mr. Matt VIP Member

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#25 16 years ago

This is an old thread, so old I'm inclined not to bother replying. But the heck with it. I don't know where you got that 'master' and 'apprentice' stuff from... but I know far more better players who'd dueled someone 1-on-1 and been taught the ropes than I do people who've gone into a FFA server where people run around with rocket launchers, and the only move they learn is the Strong Lunge. And as for the American comment, whether you think that's an actual fact or you're just being patriotic... the first time I ever encountered a server that had such rules... it was an American server. British servers at least remained corporate and rule-less, or just locked clan servers, for the most part until people saw how good the atmosphere was. There is no skill, IMO anyway, in running around randomly swinging or Lunging, or firing a blaster rifle in the general direction of an enemy. There is skill in defeating an opponent on a 1-on-1 basis, which is usually the way it goes in a server with such rules. Many new players I see like someone to take them aside and teach them each individual move so that they can learn to apply them in their own way. How can you do that if someone continually fires a rocket up your rear? Or lunges at you every time you stand still? They can't. If your idea of a new player learning the ropes is to kill him as much as possible, you must go to some pretty dull, random places. Hey, if you or people you know have learnt that way, fine. I wouldn't hold much hope for you in a straight duel, but I haven't seen you play. The thing you have to remember is... a soldier is never given target practises on the field. He doesn't have to learn by either shooting at the enemy or he dies. He is taught the ropes, then put through some drills, then sent out into the field. Apart from the fact that they don't get a second chance and it would cost too much; with some basics behind them, they're much more efficient. Besides, there are plenty of servers without rules. Most new players will most likely connect to these first as they are generally low ping, recognisable companies such as BlueYonder, or whatever the USA equivilent is. And, besides again, this is the wrong thread for your kind of argument, there is one called ''This may be an unpopular opinion, but...'' that you should be shouting about it in. Like I said in there, if you want to play a certain way, do it in a server that doesn't mind. Save everyone a lot of trouble. Anyway, leave this thread everyone, so it drops out of sight. Its months old now, let it die. Or any adiministrator kind enough to lock it, would you do so please?




RaSiN_HeCk

3...2...1... Lets Jam!

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14th September 2002

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#26 16 years ago

man...I just realized how much of the game I'm missing, holy crap!

ok..WOAH gimme a sec....ok

I BS a lot...but with friends, and I usually respect my friends too. so I do the 'honor code' but it's really all respect. now on other server where i don't know anyone I hardly ever talk unless I'm REALLY bored or just nothings happening.

and if the 'padawans' leaving is probabbly because they just don't like the game, which it is. just a game!




NiteStryker

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24th April 2003

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#27 16 years ago

While I agree with this thread creator's opinion, I think its a matter of ego for the "experienced". They see an easy target, and want to get moral boost, so they pick on the paddy. Most private servers, non-clan, have no respect for others. Name urself "Dolphin Molestor", same results. There are no rules there. Clan servers are for clans, obviously, but those clans uphold respect, therefore treating the new people with said respect. But, your findings were interesting. Also, most vet playa dont wanna take the time to instruct the noob, even tho that would make themselves feel MUCH better than just killing him, but they dont see that. They are lazy, and go for whats easier. Ill have to try your experiment out. I dont think JK2 is dying tho, I just think its ageing. JK3 is fast approaching *THANK GOD*, lol, and JK2 has just lost its release-flare, but I dont think its dead..then agian, wtf do I know?




Evil_Jedi

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20th June 2003

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#28 16 years ago

Very good point...It makes me think of MY first day too...I couldn't even get to the pad in Bespin without bein thrown off near that roof...That again, it's not always fun to be hangin 'round with noobs because they don't know the rules about "saber down = peace " and stuff. But you made me think a little more too. A noob in my server will stay untill they leave from now on. THANKS DUDE!




Mr. Matt VIP Member

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#29 16 years ago

Well this thread WAS started months ago, Nite... yeah, all games come to an end someday. It'd be nice to keep the online gamers there until JK3 is released though. I play JK2 as often as I drive now, there's no game I own that has such decent melee combat instead of all that running around shooting each other, which I'm not fond of anymore (since I got JK2, funnily enough...).




Jeff Über Admin

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#30 16 years ago

[begin rant] people need to just get rid of all these 'moral' rules that everyone invents, and play the game how its supposed to be played. I own jk2, and no where on it did it say "now before you go multiplayer, you must adhere to an unofficial codebook letting you know what you're allowed to do"

the downfall of every online game is the users interference in the rules on which it was created. plain and simple. I've played online games since they first went online, and it's either the game was too old (that was back in the old days when I was just a wee lad in high school), or users make up rules and expect everyone else to follow them.. after that the game isn't played anymore.

That also relates to how you treat new players since they don't know your ****ing stupid add-on rules and you treat them like they're supposed to know. I may just get FF to create a damned server, you try any of that lame-ass my saber wasn't on, you can't kill me, and I'm jumping in with god-mode and smacking you around until you leave. that will be my user created rule. [end rant]

sorry if you don't agree with me, thats my feeling and I stick by it.

To Mods: no need to close this thread if you feel that I flamed it, just edit my post if you feel its necessary. Thanks.


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