Bush refuses to withdraw 70 replies

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Shintsu

For the glory of Helghan

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9th April 2005

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#1 12 years ago

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Yahoo News RIGA, Latvia - Under intense pressure to change course, President Bush on Tuesday rejected suggestions Iraq has fallen into civil war and vowed not to pull U.S. troops out "until the mission is complete." At the opening of a NATO summit, Bush also urged allies to increase their forces in Afghanistan to confront a strengthening Taliban insurgency.

On the eve of his visit to Jordan for meetings with Iraqi Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki, Bush portrayed the battles in both Afghanistan and Iraq as central fronts in a war "against the extremists who desire safe havens and are willing to kill innocents anywhere to achieve their objectives."

The stakes in Iraq are huge for Bush. His war policies were repudiated in U.S. midterm elections that handed control of Congress to Democrats. A bipartisan blue-ribbon panel is about to issue a report proposing changes in the administration's approach in Iraq. And al-Maliki's government itself sometimes seems to be at cross purposes with Washington.

Bush set the stage for the Jordan talks with a speech at the NATO summit here and at an earlier news conference in neighboring Estonia. The president said he was flexible and eager to hear al-Maliki's ideas on how to ease the violence.

"There's one thing I'm not going to do, I'm not going to pull our troops off the battlefield before the mission is complete," Bush declared in his speech. There are about 140,000 U.S. forces in Iraq.

Earlier, speaking with reporters in Tallinn during a joint news conference with Estonia's president, Bush would not debate whether Iraq had fallen into civil war and blamed the increasing bloodshed on a pattern of sectarian violence that he said was set in motion last winter by al-Qaida followers.

"I'm going to bring this subject up, of course, with Prime Minister Maliki," Bush said. "My questions to him will be: What do you need to do to succeed? What is your strategy in dealing with the sectarian violence?"

Bush said he realized that "no question it's dangerous there, and violent. And the Maliki government is going to have to deal with that violence, and we want to help them do so."

Bush has been coming under increasing pressure, both overseas and at home, to reach out more to other countries, particularly to Syria and Iran to help with a solution in Iraq.

Such a recommendation may be among those issued by the Iraq Study Group headed by former Secretary of State James A. Baker III and former Democratic Rep. Lee Hamilton. The group is expected to finish its work next month.

Bush has resisted such talks, and he renewed a warning on Tuesday to both Iran and Syria not to meddle in Iraq. Still, al-Maliki's government itself has made overtures to both countries.

"As far as Iraq goes, the Iraqi government is a sovereign government capable of handling its own foreign policies and is in the process of doing so," Bush said in Tallinn.

Later, Bush's national security adviser, Stephen Hadley, said that Bush and al-Maliki have "a relationship of candor."

"A lot of discussion has been about (Bush) pushing Maliki. Maliki has done a lot of pushing himself," Hadley said. "There has been a coordinated effort between the Iraqi government and allied forces to get greater control. ... It has not produced satisfactory progress in a satisfactory timeframe."

Meanwhile, in Washington, House Speaker-to-be Nancy Pelosi said Bush must work with Democrats on stopping the violence in Iraq.

"We want to work in a bipartisan way to settle this," Pelosi said. "If the president persists on the course that he is on, that will be more difficult."

In Riga, Bush pressed many of the 26 NATO allies to do more to marshal resources and troops in Afghanistan, particularly in the volatile south.

Bush said the Afghanistan mission — which has mobilized over 32,000 troops_ is NATO's top operation and defeating Taliban forces "will require the full commitment of our alliance."

"The commanders on the ground must have the resources and flexibility they need to do their jobs," he said.

Bush met individually with NATO Secretary-General Jaap de Hoop Scheffer and joined other leaders in attending a working dinner.

Hadley, Bush's national security adviser, said that Bush brought up a need for "additional defense capabilities and additional defense spending" in the meeting with the secretary-general and also intended to discuss it at the dinner.

In both Baltic countries, Bush on Tuesday saluted their persistence in eventually prevailing over Soviet occupiers, and he said it was a good example for both Afghanistan and Iraq.

What a shock, our ignorant ass president thinks we should "finish the mission." Hey we really F**ked up, but lets not stop it now because we're supposed to know what to do and it is impossible for us to admit we were wrong! This war is pointless and is just getting more people killed every day that shouldn't be. We need to get the hell out of there and let them deal with themselves, at least for our troops sake.




Guest

I didn't make it!

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#2 12 years ago

If we pull out now even more Iraqis will die. It is our DUTY to see this through to the end. Maybe it was a fbad idea to go in, many people think so(not me), but seeing it through to the end is ESSENTIAL.

As many would say, it's our mess and we have to clean it up. And it certaiinly is a mess, even someone like me will admit that.




Jill

Idiot Action-Adventure Girl

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7th July 2006

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#3 12 years ago

Well....I guess we will withdraw 2 years from now after he is out of office.




Guest

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#4 12 years ago

Shintsu;3392575Source:

What a shock, our ignorant ass president thinks we should "finish the mission." Hey we really F**ked up, but lets not stop it now because we're supposed to know what to do and it is impossible for us to admit we were wrong! This war is pointless and is just getting more people killed every day that shouldn't be. We need to get the hell out of there and let them deal with themselves, at least for our troops sake.

Oh take that "for our troops" bullshit and stick it where the son don't shine.

If we withdraw, it will be systematic genocide, and the only area that won't be fucked over is Kurdistan. Perhaps you should actually have a good idea what it's like to be over there before you say stupid things like this again.




Karst

I chose an eternity of this

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6th January 2005

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#5 12 years ago

Afterburner;3392765If we pull out now even more Iraqis will die. It is our DUTY to see this through to the end. Maybe it was a fbad idea to go in, many people think so(not me), but seeing it through to the end is ESSENTIAL.

As many would say, it's our mess and we have to clean it up. And it certaiinly is a mess, even someone like me will admit that.

Exactly. Agree with the war or not, the last thing that should be done is to just leave. They can't just invade and leave those countries in near-anarchy. But i also think something about the method needs to be changed. Simply having troops present is obviously not doing much to hem the violence. The most important concern now is creating a capable native military police. The foreign troops should be recalled as soon as possible, but certainly not before. Their jobs MUST be completed first. They must leave the country in a stable state.




Guest

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#6 12 years ago
Karst;3392883Exactly. Agree with the war or not, the last thing that should be done is to just leave. They can't just invade and leave those countries in near-anarchy. But i also think something about the method needs to be changed. Simply having troops present is obviously not doing much to hem the violence. The most important concern now is creating a capable native military police. The foreign troops should be recalled as soon as possible, but certainly not before. Their jobs MUST be completed first. They must leave the country in a stable state.

I think RLt said before hes seen first hand that the police forces are progressing very well. I would trust whatever him and the others who are serving over there say more then the media.




-DarthMaul-

I'm way cooler than n0e (who isn't though?)

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11th February 2003

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#7 12 years ago

Iran and Syria need to be more involved this will fix the problem.




Artie Bucco

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27th April 2003

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#8 12 years ago

yet we have news that the anbar provicne is growing even more out of hand. http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/11/27/AR2006112701287.html

Utter crap mate, sorry but the influence of Foreigners is an excuse, 95% of the insurgency are all homegrown Iraqi's, who all had jobs 4 years ago, and were part of a Regime that supported them and their families. The Influence of Syria and Iran are there, but they were there before the Invasion,in my opinion it's an excuse to use by an Administration that has totally fcuked up in post war planning......It's naive to think that such influences would not have cropped up before deciding to Invade in the first place..... The insurgency in Iraq was well planned in advance, and had this war not been done on the cheap, then perhaps things would be different? The Americans and it's Allies rode in, in their Armoured beasts and made promises to the "Liberated Iraqi people" that they didn't fulfill, in terms of getting the infrastructure sorted,we made promises to the Iraqi people that we as a Liberating Force did not keep. Then Bremer decided to disband the entire Iraqi Security Structure.......thus opening pandoras box, Foreign Fighters and Terrorist orginisations then began to exploit the gaps left,and have never looked back....... I'd also go as far as saying that at least 50% of the insurgency commit acts as they're being paid to do so, to them it's a way to make money,and lets not kid ourselves, if our respective countries were Invaded and our way of life changed, each and every one of us would be compelled to do our part....... Whens the last time you spoke to a Baghdad Sunni mate?......we have LN's on our team who still support Saddam,and think he's innocent of all charges!.......how can you legislate for opinions like this?.....When I was down in the South near the Iranian border earlier this year,I worked with Shi'ia's, who told me in no uncertain terms that through time, they'd make the Sunni's pay for their suppression, and the same Sunni's say they'd love to wipe the Shia off the map.... Add to this tribalism,where unless you're related to someone in a particular area, you stand a chance of not getting out alive, should you find yourself in a particular area........Tribal loyalty is something we Westerners have no comprehension of,local Sheikh's and tribal elders are very influencial people,there's nothing they don't control, and have influence over,including Police and Military. Power and Oil?.........hardly, the Oil Industry is in shyt state in Iraq, it'll cost Billions for it to meet Western Standards,there are only a couple of refineries in Iraq....they're constantly under attack,and the lines sabotaged. Power......that's what every Government strives for, greater power over their rivals....We have tried to impose a Western style democracy on a people that have been controlled by some kind of Regime for almost a Genearation,Iraqi's can now say "No, I'll fix it tommorow"..under Saddam it was fixed immediately,otherwise heads would role.....literally.... Iraq is a mess right now,and from where I'm sitting, doesn't seem to have that bright and rosy future ahead of it.......sure we've done some great things in terms of reconstruction, but there is an air of tension you can cut with a knife.....liberated people are not supposed to fear the shadows mate..... Even the Military have taken a step back, they need to launch a serious of offensives again,instead of sitting back and allowing an Army that's about as much use as a paper canoe provide security on the streets,an Army that's sympathetic in most cases to the insurgency,who sit back and do nothing when Western PSC's are in a complex Ambush,who sometimes contribute to the ambush.......I used to give them the benefit of the doubt..........now I don't trust anyone in Uniform that is not Western on the streets of Iraq. -Argyll a PSC off the military photos forum.




AlDaja

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5th September 2006

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#9 12 years ago

Right, wrong or indifferent, if we leave now we will be committing thousands to their doom and that is far more grievous than being over there in our current capacity. Have we learned nothing from Vietnam?




Guest

I didn't make it!

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#10 12 years ago

Artie Bucco;3392920yet we have news that the anbar provicne is growing even more out of hand. http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/11/27/AR2006112701287.html

Utter crap mate, sorry but the influence of Foreigners is an excuse, 95% of the insurgency are all homegrown Iraqi's, who all had jobs 4 years ago, and were part of a Regime that supported them and their families. The Influence of Syria and Iran are there, but they were there before the Invasion,in my opinion it's an excuse to use by an Administration that has totally fcuked up in post war planning......It's naive to think that such influences would not have cropped up before deciding to Invade in the first place..... The insurgency in Iraq was well planned in advance, and had this war not been done on the cheap, then perhaps things would be different? The Americans and it's Allies rode in, in their Armoured beasts and made promises to the "Liberated Iraqi people" that they didn't fulfill, in terms of getting the infrastructure sorted,we made promises to the Iraqi people that we as a Liberating Force did not keep. Then Bremer decided to disband the entire Iraqi Security Structure.......thus opening pandoras box, Foreign Fighters and Terrorist orginisations then began to exploit the gaps left,and have never looked back....... I'd also go as far as saying that at least 50% of the insurgency commit acts as they're being paid to do so, to them it's a way to make money,and lets not kid ourselves, if our respective countries were Invaded and our way of life changed, each and every one of us would be compelled to do our part....... Whens the last time you spoke to a Baghdad Sunni mate?......we have LN's on our team who still support Saddam,and think he's innocent of all charges!.......how can you legislate for opinions like this?.....When I was down in the South near the Iranian border earlier this year,I worked with Shi'ia's, who told me in no uncertain terms that through time, they'd make the Sunni's pay for their suppression, and the same Sunni's say they'd love to wipe the Shia off the map.... Add to this tribalism,where unless you're related to someone in a particular area, you stand a chance of not getting out alive, should you find yourself in a particular area........Tribal loyalty is something we Westerners have no comprehension of,local Sheikh's and tribal elders are very influencial people,there's nothing they don't control, and have influence over,including Police and Military. Power and Oil?.........hardly, the Oil Industry is in shyt state in Iraq, it'll cost Billions for it to meet Western Standards,there are only a couple of refineries in Iraq....they're constantly under attack,and the lines sabotaged. Power......that's what every Government strives for, greater power over their rivals....We have tried to impose a Western style democracy on a people that have been controlled by some kind of Regime for almost a Genearation,Iraqi's can now say "No, I'll fix it tommorow"..under Saddam it was fixed immediately,otherwise heads would role.....literally.... Iraq is a mess right now,and from where I'm sitting, doesn't seem to have that bright and rosy future ahead of it.......sure we've done some great things in terms of reconstruction, but there is an air of tension you can cut with a knife.....liberated people are not supposed to fear the shadows mate..... Even the Military have taken a step back, they need to launch a serious of offensives again,instead of sitting back and allowing an Army that's about as much use as a paper canoe provide security on the streets,an Army that's sympathetic in most cases to the insurgency,who sit back and do nothing when Western PSC's are in a complex Ambush,who sometimes contribute to the ambush.......I used to give them the benefit of the doubt..........now I don't trust anyone in Uniform that is not Western on the streets of Iraq. -Argyll a PSC off the military photos forum.

He's right. The insurgency is mostly Iraqi. If you count insurgents from being different than terrorists.