Civil Service 76 replies

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#71 11 years ago
Karst;3574237Nice idea but i'm afraid it wouldn't suffice. There simply aren't enough volunteers for those services.

Too bad, really. If something can't be accomplished through work(as in willing, paid labor, not forced labor) or charity, then it shouldn't be accomplished.




~LK~

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#72 11 years ago

Relander;3575408I guess you didn't even check the link which I provided. Majority means more than half so I cannot see how it's majority rule when looking actual representation of people (of those who voted). It doesn't matter how many constituencies there are as it doesn't change the basics of the system: the canditate with more votes than anyone else, wins. He/she may or may not enjoy from the support of majority and same applies to US presidential elections as well. In 1992 Bill Clinton received just 43% from the votes but he got elected due to the fact that he got more votes than two other major canditates, Bush receiving 37,4% and Ross Perot 18.9% from votes.

In a sense you could regard it as majority rule but only if there are just two canditates around because then the other one have to get more than half of the votes to get elected. However if there's even third canditate around (like in 1992 US presidential elections), it doesn't require majority but just plurality of votes. Straight and simple.

I'm not trying to argue with your interpretation, because in many cases your right. But, by majority rule here, more than just the majority of the entire country is a factor. Each state is it's own entity in the union, so whoever gets the majority of the votes in each state carry that state thus getting the states aloted vote(s). It depends on "what" majority we are speaking about.. a states majority, or the entire countries populace vote. It doesnt necessarily matter if theres two candidates or ten. Out of all the votes cast, again depending on which your talking about (state or entire country), who ever gets the "majority of the votes cast, carry's that area. It's important to remember the U.S. is a union. Your right though, I did not check your link so my apology.




Relander

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#73 11 years ago

Free Online Dictionary, word "majority" ma·jor·i·ty n. pl. ma·jor·i·ties

1. The greater number or part; a number more than half of the total. 2. The amount by which the greater number of votes cast, as in an election, exceeds the total number of remaining votes.[/quote] [quote=Free Online Dictionary, word "plurality"] plu·ral·i·ty n. pl. plu·ral·i·ties

4. a. In a contest of more than two choices, the number of votes cast for the winning choice if this number is not more than one half of the total votes cast. b. The number by which the vote of the winning choice in such a contest exceeds that of the closest opponent.

When a canditate receives 51 from 100 votes, he got majority of total votes. When a canditate receives 40 from 100 votes but more than anyone else, he got plurality of total votes. Where as in the first case the canditate would actually represent majority of people, 51 out of 100 which is more than half of them, in the second case he represents just minority, those 40 out from 100. Majority and plurality are two different things, it isn't about interpretation but about actual meaning of words. This shouldn't be rocket science.

It doesn't matter if the elections are about electing a city mayor, senator or even a president as the fact remains: political canditates in the USA may get elected into office with just the minority of total votes cast due to "first-past-the-post" election system which is undemocratic (if we accept thesis that democracy is essentially about majority rule) and which only gets worse the more local level you get into.

Sure, to get elected into president of the USA, a canditate requires support by majority of electoral college votes but not necessarily a support of majority of voters like was the case in 2000: George W. Bush received 50 460 110 votes but other canditates got 54 957 148 votes in total (which of Al Gore got 51 003 926).




Karst

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#74 11 years ago
Afterburner;3575472Too bad, really. If something can't be accomplished through work(as in willing, paid labor, not forced labor) or charity, then it shouldn't be accomplished.

But these services are essential, i'm afraid. They can't simply not be offered. Also i think you have kind of a wrong view of civil service; it is paid, and it is willing in the sense that you could do military instead and choose where you want to serve. So i don't believe it can realistically be called forced labor.




~LK~

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#75 11 years ago

Your just not getting it relander for some reason. well, its not even a main issue in this thread so it doesnt really matter.




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#76 11 years ago
Karst;3575765But these services are essential, i'm afraid. They can't simply not be offered.

How are they essential? Is society going to collapse without them? Because it is collapsing with them.

Also i think you have kind of a wrong view of civil service; it is paid, and it is willing in the sense that you could do military instead and choose where you want to serve. So i don't believe it can realistically be called forced labor.

Can you choose to do neither? You can't so it's forced labor.




Karst

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#77 11 years ago
Afterburner;3576866How are they essential? Is society going to collapse without them?

For the ones affected, yes. If no one would drive ambulances, people couldn't get to a hospital, for example.

Because it is collapsing with them.

What are you talking about?

Can you choose to do neither? You can't so it's forced labor.

You can choose to resign your citizenship, if it was really so terrible for you.