I fail to see how Islam can be considered "enlightened" considering this 51 replies

Please wait...

emonkies

I'm too cool to Post

50 XP

17th July 2003

0 Uploads

15,096 Posts

0 Threads

#1 10 years ago

Saudis defend punishment for rape victim - Yahoo! News

I just dont get it.

My apologies, poor choice of wording for thread title.

Believe it or not this is not a attack on Islam.

Muslims I know in the US and Britain are horrified by this.




RadioactiveLobster Forum Admin

Jeff is a mean boss

565,307 XP

28th July 2002

0 Uploads

53,117 Posts

1,329 Threads

#2 10 years ago

They are a backwards bunch....

Islam (at least in that part of the world) has such a poor respect for women its sickening.


If there is no image, Mikey broke something...



Aeroflot

I would die without GF

169,400 XP

2nd May 2003

0 Uploads

15,205 Posts

0 Threads

#3 10 years ago

Here's an article with more information:

Spoiler: Show

(CNN) -- The husband of a Saudi rape victim sentenced to 200 lashes and six months in prison said his wife is "a crushed human being," and blamed one judge with a personal vendetta -- and not the Saudi judicial system -- for treating her as a criminal. art.king.abdullah.afp.gi.jpgHuman rights groups want Saudi Arabia's King Abdullah to drop charges against the rape victim.

corner_wire_BL.gif

But he said Saudi society was respectful of women and he had faith that his wife would get justice. In March 2006, the woman, then 18 and engaged to be married, and an unrelated man were abducted from a mall in Qatif, Saudi Arabia and raped by a group of seven men. In October, the men were convicted and sentenced to between two and nine years in prison for the assault. She was convicted of violating the kingdom's strict Islamic law by not having a male guardian with her at the mall. "From the outset, my wife was dealt with as a guilty person who committed a crime," said her 24-year-old husband. "She was not given any chance to prove her innocence or describe how she was a victim of multiple brutal rapes." The husband, who asked not to be named, spoke to CNN Senior Arab Affairs Editor Octavia Nasr. He spoke in Arabic and Nasr translated his words into English for this story. video.gifWatch victim's husband attack judicial system » His wife, who he said is "a quiet, simple person who does not bother anyone," is in ill health and too fragile to speak about the case, he said. As her guardian under Saudi law, he is standing up for her publicly. Don't Miss

The attack, trial and sentencing have taken a heavy toll on his wife's health, which was already poor, he said. She suffers from anemia, a blood disorder , and asthma, he said. She will have surgery next month to remove her gallbladder. "Since the attack, she's been suffering from severe depression." The events ended her pursuit of an education beyond high school, he said. "Her situation keeps changing from bad to worse," he said. "You could say she's a crushed human being." "The court proceedings were like a spectacle at times," he said. "The criminals were allowed in the same room as my wife. They were allowed to make all kinds of offensive gestures and give her dirty and threatening looks." Of the three judges at the trial, one of them "was mean and from the beginning dealt with my wife as a guilty person who had done something wrong," he said. "Even when he pronounced the sentence he said to her, 'You were involved in a suspicious relationship and you deserve 200 lashes for that'," he said. Her lawyer, Abdulrahman al-Lahim, was dismissed by the judge after the two clashed in court, he said. "The judge took things personally and was reacting to our lawyer, who's a known human rights activist," he said. "The judge undermined the lawyer, decreased his role and then dismissed him from the case altogether. The judge simply couldn't work with our lawyer." The woman was originally sentenced in October 2006 to 90 lashes, but when she appealed that sentence, the court more than doubled it. The husband said it was a judge pursuing "a personal vendetta." "We were shocked when the judgment changed and her sentence was doubled," the husband said. "We were looking for pardon; instead she got double the whipping and more jail time." A court source told Arab News, an English-language Middle Eastern daily newspaper, that the woman's sentence was increased after the woman spoke to the media about the case. But a Justice Ministry statement said the permanent committee of the Supreme Judicial Council recommended an increased sentence for the woman after further evidence came to light against her when she appealed her original sentence. "If this sentence is based on the law then I would've welcomed it," he said. "But it is harsh and the Saudi society I know and belong to is more sympathetic than that. I do not expect such harshness from Saudis, but rather compassion and support of the victim and her rights." Saudi society, he said, is "is very respectful to women in general." "If a woman raises her voice to a man in public, it would be very unusual for the man to respond or argue," he said. "When a woman enters a bank for instance and there is no women's section, all the men make way for the woman to go ahead of them and get her business first. I would think that putting seven men in jail for rape shouldn't be difficult." Despite the treatment given his wife by the Saudi judicial system, he believes his society respects human rights and he is optimistic about the future. "Through this case, as a citizen and stemming from my sense of security and patriotism, I believe in the future... And I have faith and trust in the system," he said. The case, which has sparked media scrutiny of the Saudi legal system, has drawn a strong reaction from Washington where State Department spokesman Sean McCormack said U.S. officials had "expressed astonishment" at the sentence, though not directly to Saudi officials. Human Rights Watch said it has called on Saudi Arabia's King Abdullah "to immediately void the verdict and drop all charges against the rape victim and to order the court to end its harassment of her lawyer." The man and woman were attacked after they met in Qatif on the kingdom's Persian Gulf coast, so she could retrieve an old photograph of herself from him, according to al-Lahim. Citing phone records from the police investigation, al-Lahim said the man was trying to blackmail his client. He noted the photo she was trying to retrieve was harmless and did not show his client in any compromising position. Al-Lahim said the man tried to blame his client for insisting on meeting him that day. It is illegal for a woman to meet with an unrelated male under Saudi's Islamic law. Al-Lahim has been ordered to attend a disciplinary hearing at the Ministry of Justice next month, where he faces a possible three-year suspension and disbarment, according to Human Rights Watch. He told CNN he has appealed to the Ministry of Justice to reinstate his law license and plans to meet with Justice Minister Abdullah bin Muhammad bin Ibrahim Al Al-Sheikh. "Currently she doesn't have a lawyer, and I feel they're doing this to isolate her and deprive her from her basic rights," he said. "We will not accept this judgment and I'll do my best to continue representing her because justice needs to take place." He said the handling of the case is a direct contradiction of judicial reforms announced by the Saudi king earlier this month. "The Ministry of Justice needs to have a very clear standing regarding this case because I consider this decision to be judiciary mutiny against the reform that King Abdullah bin Abdulaziz started and against Saudi women who are being victimized because of such decisions," he said. Under law in Saudi Arabia, women are subject to numerous restrictions, including a strict dress code, a prohibition on driving and a requirement that they get a man's permission to travel or have surgery. Women are also not allowed to testify in court unless it is about a private matter that was not observed by a man, and they are not allowed to vote. The Saudi government recently has taken some steps toward bettering the situation of women in the kingdom, including the establishment earlier this year of special courts to handle domestic abuse cases, adoption of a new labor law that addresses working women's rights and creation of a human rights commission.

I disagree with SA's laws. Just a couple weeks ago we talked about women's rights in the Middle East, and SA had one of the worst reputations. Women cannot drive, must have husbands, cannot vote, and must wear burqas outside.




Roaming East

Ultima ratio regum

50 XP

7th November 2005

0 Uploads

4,770 Posts

0 Threads

#4 10 years ago

From what I understand, this issue isnt so much an Islamic thing as much as its a backwards ass SA thing trying to veil itself as religiously inspired. Like if the US started executing potheads and said we are doing so because God said executing criminals was honkey dory




Dalt

Also known as general_mario

50 XP

7th November 2007

0 Uploads

338 Posts

0 Threads

#5 10 years ago

they don't respect women. they say that they ban them from having a normal life because they "care" about them.




AzH

I'm too cool to Post

269,650 XP

17th September 2003

0 Uploads

24,050 Posts

0 Threads

#6 10 years ago
Aeroflotte;4046123I disagree with SA's laws.

I disagree with American laws which allow for the execution of human beings (I don't, it's just an example). Just because you disagree with the law of their land doesn't mean it is wrong. In fact, in my opinion, there are facets of Saudi law that I would like to see adopted by this country. Example:

Saudi Arabia executes 4 Sri Lankans for armed robbery

Imagine the effect that the above would have on armed robberies in the Uk or the US? If you knew that by commited THIS CRIME you would get THAT PUNSIHMENT, would you still go ahead? It kinda makes people think 'is it worth it'.

Rehabilitation does not work. The justice system in our nations is a fucking joke. Criminals go to prison to learn to be better criminals. Execution is a MUCH sterner sentence and would PREVENT the crime in the first place.

In all cases, prevention is better than cure. Why should my/our tax pounds/dollars be spent on food shelter and clothing for people who give nothing to society? Better to discourage the criminal than try to cure them.




Aeroflot

I would die without GF

169,400 XP

2nd May 2003

0 Uploads

15,205 Posts

0 Threads

#7 10 years ago

I never used the word 'wrong' in my post.

However, I am now saying I think it is wrong that the women MUST be subjected to these awful laws. I understand that Muslim women might accept wearing the burqa or adhere to the other laws, but not all Muslim women want to be subjected.

As for some of the other laws, such as only Muslims may be citizens of the country, and converts to Christianity can be imprisoned; I also believe those are wrong.

I am aware that what I think is wrong might not necessarily be wrong, though. It's what I think.




Karst

I chose an eternity of this

50 XP

6th January 2005

0 Uploads

4,505 Posts

0 Threads

#8 10 years ago

And the international community is going on and on on how totalitarian, unjust and whatever Iran is, when Saudi Arabia, probably the worst country in the world for a woman to live in and one of the most oppressive overall, is considered a good friend.




KoЯsakoff

Captain

50 XP

7th November 2003

0 Uploads

6,585 Posts

0 Threads

#9 10 years ago

AzH;4046164I disagree with American laws which allow for the execution of human beings (I don't, it's just an example). Just because you disagree with the law of their land doesn't mean it is wrong. In fact, in my opinion, there are facets of Saudi law that I would like to see adopted by this country. Example:

Saudi Arabia executes 4 Sri Lankans for armed robbery

Imagine the effect that the above would have on armed robberies in the Uk or the US? If you knew that by commited THIS CRIME you would get THAT PUNSIHMENT, would you still go ahead? It kinda makes people think 'is it worth it'.

Rehabilitation does not work. The justice system in our nations is a fucking joke. Criminals go to prison to learn to be better criminals. Execution is a MUCH sterner sentence and would PREVENT the crime in the first place.

In all cases, prevention is better than cure. Why should my/our tax pounds/dollars be spent on food shelter and clothing for people who give nothing to society? Better to discourage the criminal than try to cure them.

And what if it would be you that got charged AND convicted of a crime you didn't commit? How would your family for example react to that? How would you react to that? Sure enough the system is a joke but do you see another option besides the death penalty? I'm not against the death penalty, I wish that the Dutch government would accept the fact that some crimes indeed deserve the death penalty. Like child rapings, mass murder, etc. In all I agree on your opinion that prevention is better then to "cure" or "rehabilitation".




AzH

I'm too cool to Post

269,650 XP

17th September 2003

0 Uploads

24,050 Posts

0 Threads

#10 10 years ago

KoЯsakoff;4046740And what if it would be you that got charged AND convicted of a crime you didn't commit? How would your family for example react to that? How would you react to that? Sure enough the system is a joke but do you see another option besides the death penalty? I'm not against the death penalty, I wish that the Dutch government would accept the fact that some crimes indeed deserve the death penalty. Like child rapings, mass murder, etc.[/QUOTE] Why would I be charhed and/or convicted? Even people who are found, eventually, not guilty of a crime, are under suspicion for some reason.

[QUOTE=KoЯsakoff;4046740]In all I agree on your opinion that prevention is better then to "cure" or "rehabilitation".

I thought you might, because I rock!!