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NiteStryker

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#31 11 years ago

missing.string;4970118And what of disputes? One word against another? [/QUOTE] Im not saying dont have a trial and convict the fool, collecting evidence and the like. But you get it done in a week, a month at the latest pending various test results for the more complicated stuff. Everyone on California death row right now (600 something people I think) will die of natural causes before they die of the lethal injection. Unacceptable. (Not to mention the lethal injection is a joke...need to do electric chair or firing squad. None of this "anesthesia" crap so the convict "doesnt feel pain").

But simple shit like a cop catches a 15 year old tagging, or they catch someone robbing a bank, kill them right then and there.

missing.string;4970118 Not to mention that a legal system based on principles such as the ones you mentioned would not be socially accepted. [/QUOTE] And why is that?

[QUOTE=missing.string;4970118] Besides, I'm sure most people have committed some bizarre and unknown crime at some point in their lives. Do you propose that instead of giving people parking tickets, we shoot them in the head?

Depends on the circumstances of said parking ticket. Are their signs posted in the area that are clearly visible saying "no parking"? Or did the meter run out and the person wasnt keeping track? Is it their first offense? What were they doing while the car was there? If they double parked to run their child into a hospital, vs they didnt want to put coins in the meter.

[QUOTE=Nemmerle;4970181]You seem to have missed the point. If I know you're comming to kill me I'm not going to role over and take it; I'm going hunting, and the things I'm hunting are going to be policemen, their families, politicians, school children, the occasional economic target. I'm making a list and working my way down it until someone kills me or I get to the end. I will make it so incredibly costly to your society because it's not going to cost me anything. There's nothing left for you to do to me.

If you have a purpose for doing that shit, it will make it that much funner to shoot you in the head. You act like people will be bred to be criminals just to be killed in my society. No. If you do something obviously illegal and obviously out of line, you loose your right to live. Many people with criminal pasts already live with the knowledge they will be caught one day, and those that decide to go out "in a blaze of glory" just end up a pile of flesh and blood when they take shotgun blasts to the face from a SWAT team.




WiseBobo

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#32 11 years ago
AlDaja;4968209[COLOR=black]Most rational open mind people share a commonality, or compatibility of sorts with conventional conservatism and liberal ideals, this tends to come about for most individuals who have been around the block a bit and have had a chance to experience the cause and effect of living in the real world aside from coercions they’ve absorbed from parental or academic suggestives. The political radical and their lesser lockstep misinformed companions seem to define strict view points of their party affiliation based on what they are told, not necessarily experienced. Political positioning from many hard pressed “liberal” and “conservative” minded individuals, tend to be imbecilic apologetic drones for their party, unwilling to yield the possibility their position may be wrong. I prefer the individual that takes an issue(s) mulls over it for a bit and then provides an educated opinion on a topic. I myself have drifted back and forth on topics depending on how they relate to my well-being and the nation as a whole. I tend to reserve my judgment until I have facts about what it is I’m attempting to formulate an opinion about. Abortion for example…it is not a black and white situation and many scenarios as to why and why not factor in for me. I largely allow this to be a woman’s prerogative, but draw the line if it is being used as some perverse from of birth control as it conflicts with my personal moral directives.[/COLOR]

tl;dr




Nemmerle Advanced Member

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#33 11 years ago
NiteStryker;4970245Many people with criminal pasts already live with the knowledge they will be caught one day, and those that decide to go out "in a blaze of glory" just end up a pile of flesh and blood when they take shotgun blasts to the face from a SWAT team.

There's a massive difference between waiting for SWAT to come and get you and then going out, and people who go actively hunting. At the moment people live with the hope that they will somehow escape the consequencies of their actions, that even if they go to court and get convicted they will survive. It's largely that hope which stays their hand until SWAT is at the door, until fighting back is pointless. But therein lies the problem; because it is always better to hunt than be hunted; remove that hope and they're not going to sit around waiting for SWAT to do their thing.

SWAT exists within a relatively narrow tactical and strategic role. Special weapons and tactics; specialised to a specific group of tasks. The advantage that allowed SWAT to be so effective in this sort of role was held by knowing where the target lived and being able to dictate the time and enviroment in which they were engaged. That advantage is lost very quickly when you change the enviroment.




TodtheWraith

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#34 11 years ago
NiteStryker;4970245Everyone on California death row right now (600 something people I think) will die of natural causes before they die of the lethal injection. Unacceptable. (Not to mention the lethal injection is a joke...need to do electric chair or firing squad. None of this "anesthesia" crap so the convict "doesnt feel pain").

Agreed. If their well being is declared a threat to society they should be disposed of in the cheapest way possible. I'm not sure what it costs to euthanize someone, but I'm almost 100% positive it would be much cheaper to stone them.




NiteStryker

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#35 11 years ago

Nemmerle;4970363At the moment people live with the hope that they will somehow escape the consequencies of their actions, that even if they go to court and get convicted they will survive. It's largely that hope which stays their hand until SWAT is at the door, until fighting back is pointless. But therein lies the problem; because it is always better to hunt than be hunted; remove that hope and they're not going to sit around waiting for SWAT to do their thing. [/QUOTE] So you are saying that the reason the truly insane people right now are not going truly postal is because they think they are free right now after committing some henious crime?

Fuck that. Thats why I say kill on the spot. No "hope for freedom", just hope that they hit your head in the first shot and not your arteries and then just watch you bleed out. (Which I would pay money to see).

[QUOTE=Nemmerle;4970363] That advantage is lost very quickly when you change the enviroment.

But the authorities can also change the environment.




Nemmerle Advanced Member

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#36 11 years ago

NiteStryker;4970582So you are saying that the reason the truly insane people right now are not going truly postal is because they think they are free right now after committing some henious crime?[/QUOTE]

No, I'm saying hope for the future is what stays the hands of many from comiting greater acts of violence. If you actually bother to look at the writtings of people who commit those sorts of mass killings they're characterised by a persistent lack of hope. Well the only hope someone in your system has is to turn upon you, the agressor, and kill you before you can kill them.

Imagine a couple of scenarios. Cop pulls a guy over and ask to search his car? Bang, dead cop. Guy had drugs in his car. Kids are spraypainting? Bang, dead cop. Kids left lookouts.

There is no reason for the criminal to not try to kill a cop who looks like he might discover they'd done something wrong, and with remarkably few exceptions the criminal is always going to have the drop on the policeman. Because the criminal knows he has done something wrong while the policeman merely suspects.

NiteStryker;4970582Fuck that. Thats why I say kill on the spot. No "hope for freedom",

How wonderful to see the court system reduced to a guy with a gun.

I rather think I can come up with a way to kill anyone I like under that pretext. Why'd you shoot that guy? He was spraypainting on a wall. *spraypaints a bit on the wall and puts the can in the dead guy's hand* See.

[QUOTE=NiteStryker;4970582]But the authorities can also change the environment.

The criminal must always act before the authorities - that's part of the definition of guilt, you can't be guilty of something you haven't done yet. Which means the authorities are always going to be reacting. While true they can alter their enviroment they have nowhere near the degree of control that the entity with the strategic initiative in the scenario has.




NiteStryker

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#37 11 years ago

Nemmerle;4970674Well the only hope someone in your system has is to turn upon you, the agressor, and kill you before you can kill them. [/QUOTE] Brain chips implanted in everyone. You go psycho, a tiny explosion causes an aneurysm.

Nemmerle;4970674 There is no reason for the criminal to not try to kill a cop who looks like he might discover they'd done something wrong, and with remarkably few exceptions the criminal is always going to have the drop on the policeman. Because the criminal knows he has done something wrong while the policeman merely suspects. [/QUOTE] But the police act with the same procedures regardless. When you see video of incidents, the cop arrests everyone and sorts em out later.

[QUOTE=Nemmerle;4970674] How wonderful to see the court system reduced to a guy with a gun.

Most of the time, the guy is not siggint in the court room if he is an innocent little fairy. If hes there, he has done something. With few exceptions.

And it would be far more efficient. You just saw the guy rob a kwik-e-mart. You just watched it and security cameras just recorded it. Kill the robber.

[QUOTE=Nemmerle;4970674] I rather think I can come up with a way to kill anyone I like under that pretext. Why'd you shoot that guy? He was spraypainting on a wall. *spraypaints a bit on the wall and puts the can in the dead guy's hand* See.

That happens nowadays already anyways.




Nemmerle Advanced Member

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#38 11 years ago

NiteStryker;4970935Brain chips implanted in everyone. You go psycho, a tiny explosion causes an aneurysm. [/QUOTE]

Yeah, because people are totally going to let you implant explosives in their brains.

Even assuming that they would let you implant them the explosive isn't going to know if you're going psycho. Which means it would have to be remote controlled. I can't see any problems with that. :rolleyes:

And even if the above one didn't apply. The person with access to the things becomes the unquestionable dictator of whatever society he is in. Forget elections. There has to be room for civil disobedience in order that democracy can exist.

NiteStryker;4970935But the police act with the same procedures regardless. When you see video of incidents, the cop arrests everyone and sorts em out later. [/QUOTE]

Uh, no. They don't. What fucked up videos have you been watching?

NiteStryker;4970935Most of the time, the guy is not siggint in the court room if he is an innocent little fairy. If hes there, he has done something. With few exceptions.

Having done something can mean pretty much anything in the current legal system. You know how fucked up the law is. You've even commented as much on occasion.

[QUOTE=NiteStryker;4970935]And it would be far more efficient. You just saw the guy rob a kwik-e-mart. You just watched it and security cameras just recorded it. Kill the robber.

You know how crappy security camera footage is? It could be pretty much anyone, especially if they're wearing their cover.

[QUOTE=NiteStryker;4970935]That happens nowadays already anyways.

If someone frames you for spraypainting right now it's not the end of the world. There's very little motive to do it either since it's not going to get the person killed/seriously screwed over.




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#39 11 years ago

NiteStryker;4970245Im not saying dont have a trial and convict the fool, collecting evidence and the like. But you get it done in a week, a month at the latest pending various test results for the more complicated stuff. Everyone on California death row right now (600 something people I think) will die of natural causes before they die of the lethal injection. Unacceptable. (Not to mention the lethal injection is a joke...need to do electric chair or firing squad. None of this "anesthesia" crap so the convict "doesnt feel pain"). [/QUOTE] Lethal injection is considered inhumane on animals according to the Humane Society. The paralyzing drug used in lethal injections prevents the inmate from so much as frowning or lifting an eyelid. Any suffering on the receivers end would be completely undetectable. For these very reasons, veterinarians aren't supposed to use paralyzers to euthanize animals. They're also discouraged from using sodium pentothal as an anesthetic because it can wear off quickly and in rare cases, have no effect at all.

[QUOTE=TodtheWraith;4970373]Agreed. If their well being is declared a threat to society they should be disposed of in the cheapest way possible. I'm not sure what it costs to euthanize someone, but I'm almost 100% positive it would be much cheaper to stone them.

I was going so suggest bullets, but that might negate some of the satisfaction others would attain from their drawn out painful death.