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Crusader

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18th March 2008

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#1 6 years ago

Ive been seeing alot of mention of "Trolls" on the news recently and plan to widen criminal prosecution against them. How will this actually work? I mean they were saying upto Seven years in prison. I know people can be offensive and out of order, but isnt it still basically prosecting people over "hurt feelings"? Also to be honest I dont think most "Trolls" actually realise the severity of what they do, I mean, I know in theory its all "Well its wrong", but in practise, sitting behind a computer screen does add an element of distance and loss of reality to it. Whats with this current surge in "Internet Policing" anyway?




Ryojin

lolwut?

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8th November 2005

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#2 6 years ago

Well, that sounds downright ridiculous. Also, I think it's more likely to encourage trolling than it is to prevent it.


Disclaimer: Personal opinions still not endorsed by Ryojin.



Schofield VIP Member

om :A

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#3 6 years ago

Crusader;5623123I know people can be offensive and out of order, but isnt it still basically prosecting people over "hurt feelings"?[/QUOTE]

People need to suck it up most of the time. There is a limit to everything, sometimes things are just too disrespectful. But really, what exactly is the point of insulting someone? You could call someone fat - maybe they are - but why do it? You can lose a job for insulting someone, or get detention at school, there is little to no consequence for doing it outside of your home, school, or work though.

Crusader;5623123Also to be honest I dont think most "Trolls" actually realise the severity of what they do, I mean, I know in theory its all "Well its wrong", but in practise, sitting behind a computer screen does add an element of distance and loss of reality to it.

Then they aren't a troll. Trolls actively go out to do shit no one likes for some reason which fits their own psychological mythology. That's why you sometimes see people say "not sure if trolling...", because they aren't sure if it was intentional or not - trolling is intentional. [QUOTE=Crusader;5623123]Whats with this current surge in "Internet Policing" anyway?

If we have policing in normal society why shouldn't we have it in our Internet society?

If you could provide some links to wherever you saw this I would like to read them. I want to know how far they are taking this policing thing.




Guest

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#4 6 years ago

I think these cases are a little deeper than mere trolling. For instance the guy who trolled the police commissioner in NY. Sure he was trolling, but he was also making death threats or 'terroristic' threats. Who does that anyways, especially when directed at a police commissioner. The guy is probably a darwin entry running late. People like this, its not a question of why, but rather when...




Nemmerle Forum Mod

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#5 6 years ago

Social interactions are very complicated. I wouldn't care to see the government with the power to lock you up for anything they point their finger at and call trolling. Seems too close to a blank cheque.

Stalking and the like on the other hand - well the laws to address that sort of thing, as Sed notes, already exist. You shouldn't need new laws for that....




Guest

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#6 6 years ago

There's also the story about the girl who was trolled by her neighbor's parents so viscously and so constantly she eventually killed herself.

But, yeah, we'd really need a link here.




Nemmerle Forum Mod

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#7 6 years ago

And all because she couldn't find the block user function.... =p

Seriously though, many of the tools to address this sort of thing are already built into the relevant sites. It's hard to see how, if you're practising basic net-precautions, you're going to get trolled like that. Your real life and your internet life shouldn't be that strongly linked through anything you don't have a fairly high degree of control over.




Ryojin

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#8 6 years ago
Nemmerle;5623147Social interactions are very complicated. I wouldn't care to see the government with the power to lock you up for anything they point their finger at and call trolling. Seems too close to a blank cheque.

Exactly.

From my experience, trolling is mostly harmless. If someone can't handle it, then goes and kills themselves or something, then that's on them, not the one doing the trolling. If you can't handle it, then that just sucks for you. Grow the hell up and find a way to deal with the bullshit, otherwise you won't live very long.

Words alone are harmless. The people who react to the words are the ones who cause the problems.


Disclaimer: Personal opinions still not endorsed by Ryojin.



Nemmerle Forum Mod

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#9 6 years ago

It's not reasonable to expect people to just shrug it off when threats are made against them, or bad photos of them posted - stuff like that. Given that people are increasingly integrating their online and offline lives, that sort of thing can really mess up someone's reputation - especially when they're young. I think people forget how vulnerable kids are.

If you persistently go around bothering the same person, if you invade their privacy, if you threaten them; well to my mind that's every bit as serious as if you do it offline. Changing the method of communication doesn't change the character of the act.

On forums and the like.... Well that's not so much of a problem - everyone tends to go under pseudonyms, and the moderators are generally fairly good at stamping things out. But certainly on things more integrated with their lives - where the threats are more credible, the attacks on their reputation more likely to have a lasting effect....

Yes, it should carry consequences. If the law was enforced consistently, it would carry fairly severe consequences.

I just don't think you should legislate generally against trolling with something as ... temperamental ... as the legal systems we tend to have in our societies. I still think if you bully someone into killing themselves you've probably done something fairly awful, and something that's probably legally actionable under some law or another - or at least that should be. But I think that's a specific sort of law you should have - and not something aimed at trolling in general; which is a term too open to interpretation.

There's a marked difference between someone running off and killing themselves because someone said they were a bit of a cunt on a forum once or twice, and someone who kills themselves because, for example, images of their gay love affair were posted onto youtube.... The former - well, shit happens, no-one could reasonably have expected them never to be called a cunt. The latter's a hate crime with malice aforethought - and they could reasonably have expected it not to happen.




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#10 6 years ago
Nemmerle;5623154And all because she couldn't find the block user function.... =p

Well, she's dead now, so it's difficult for her.

She had some emotional problems, so they created a teen boy persona, seduced her, then took her apart.

I mean, I'll definitely agree with you that the government doesn't need a blank check to throw people in jail for social interactions. But the ability to misrepresent one's self and create problems doesn't seem exactly covered by current stalking laws. I mean, the neighbors in this case, they couldn't bring anyone to trial. I think this clearly falls under anyone's definition of stalking.

There's also the incident in which rapper The Game was being held at a police precinct awaiting booking. So he twittered that he had a new internship program, and if anyone was interested they should call. And the number he gave was for the police precinct. It's funny, except that a lady died because the phone lines were so jammed.