I disagree on that, Sedistix. I've said it before, and I'll say it again: piracy is not stealing. You do not give the company any direct damage.
If you buy a $50 CD, the company gains $50. If you download a $50 CD, the company gains $0.
Call it what you want, but I see a difference in $50. You may have some sort of logic to avoid calling it "stealing", but you can't deny that it does cause damage.
I'm a "pirate", so to speak. I download. However, I only do this for games/movies/music which otherwise I would not have played or seen. If I like it, it's likely I'll buy the dvd/cd/game afterwards either way.
Also, you do not "damage" a company, you do not steal from them. If anything, you deprive them of profit.
Depriving a company of profit sounds to me like the best way of doing damage to it.
It's stealing once you sell the game to someone else after downloading it yourself
How is the illegal distribution of something "stealing"?
"Stealing" is to take something without the owner's permission.
Demo's can be very misleading in what the game is like. Similar to games, the previews are just not good to base your opinion on.
Then read the reviews. Get onto forums and get the word-of-mouth of the forummers. OK, so some reviews are total bollocks, and many seem to go out of their way to spoil everything to you that shouldn't be spoiled (:mad:), but if you read enough of them, you will get an idea on whether or not this is the game for you.
As a side note, though, I do consider trial periods of the full game to be by far superior to a demo version.
I always got stiffed with this in the past. A group makes two or three good songs, puts them on a CD, and fills it up with utter crap for the rest. This pisses me off to a great extent. I now just choose to download those two or three good songs, instead of paying €20 for a CD.
If you have a download connection that lets you download single songs illegally, surely it lets you download them legally, too, from authorized sites. This argument doesn't fly.
Why Piracy? Low funds and high prices. It isn't as simple to put down as car theft or breaking into a jewly store because a material copy isn't stolen, it's forged for personal use.
Which justifies it how?
Let's say I... Lift a $50 CD from a store. Monetary loss is $50. Download a $50 CD from [insert site here]. Monetary loss is $50.
Call downloading whatever you want, but I see a difference of $0 from illegally downloading and shop-lifting.
If 100,000 people download an albulm, they've sold some millions for enough people to be willing to put it up for download by the 100,000.
And still developers and often publishers are chronically short on money. How can that be, hm?
And the numbers are very often not that positive?
It's a rip off when it comes down to it like a lot of things, reselling old films in HD, charging hundreds to thousands for software, charging inumerable prices for games.
I could fill a whole thread about my rantings on how hardly anyone ever release finished games anymore. But that still does not justify stealing (or your favourite euphemism).
Many "pirates" don't have the money to waste of things that might not be good, or might not be able to pay for them at all.
May I ask what's with the quotation mark?
And that's not a good argument, either.
As of now, there are probably about half a dozen films and half a dozen games I'd like to buy. But guess what, I just can't. I'm a high school student on welfare money. Does that mean I just illegally download stuff? Nope, I wait until I have the money. And guess what? I survive just fine.
7th December 2003
Plesae do not admit to illegal actions here, people who do admit to comitting crimes will have their posts deleted or censored as a precaution.
We don't want our forum to be closed down because of some silly music-industry attack, do we? :)
piratism is synonamous with theft. If you made a music CD for 2000$ put it on the Internet for sale for 10$, someone paid that ten dollars, copied it (you have a copyright)and put it on sale for 5$ and you ended up only making 10$. I doubt you'd continue to think piracy is perfectly fine.
I think the point some people are trying to make is two-fold.
1. They wouldn't buy that product anyways, so whether they pirate it or don't buy it makes no difference.
2. You are not stealing anything of value from someone when you pirate. There is no loss, of money. When you steal a copy of a CD then there is a real loss of money. That company just lost their 20$ because they produced a copy, had the copy stolen, and in turn have to produce another copy to replace it, or lose that money. When it comes to pirating all their material wealth just stays on the shelves so they don't have to produce any more copies to cover the loss.
I really don't care one way or the other. I don't download unless it is something that is actually free. Not because of any legal or moral responsibility I feel, but just because there isn't anything I want to download.
Do you remember when Saturday cartoons used to be worth watching? When you'd come home after school to see such shows as the Worst Witch; when there were heroes and villains that made you laugh and smile; when there was some value to be gained from watching? It was fun, good fun. Then TV turned to crap, 'My Parents are Aliens' and things of that ilk came on and the good stuff just became extinct in a wave of tackiness.
Why do you think this was? As with all such things the answer is inevitably economics. TV companies found out that they could lower production values and people would still stick their kids in front of the box. It's the same for all things, our generation has no Beetles or Queen, or generation has no Einstein, no Roosevelt or Washington. We're screwed up and wrung out on the altar of corporate greed. We're tied to a system that has set about with increasing brutality, for the last few hundred years, working out just how low they can push the bar for people to bend under.
The problem you see is that people are stupid scared things, oh one or two of us are alright but collectively when we don't like something we'll bitch and complain and then we'll go right back to taking it up the arse. In a world of crap people are still going to buy simply because there's no better alternatives, that bar can be pushed pretty darned low. Every now and then you'll get a breakthrough where someone decides to break with the custom and actually produce something of exceptional quality where the status quo has a chance of being restored, at least for a short amount of time. But with so much crap out there pulling in money such things become harder and harder to pull off.
So heck, get as much of the good stuff as you can while you can, because once it's gone it's gone. Pay for what you can and make sure that it's the good stuff you pay for because that will lengthen the amount of time that the good stuff survives, that's only fair and it ultimately harms you not to do it - but once you've spent your money on the good stuff then if you can get even more good stuff without harming someone, (and you won't because you couldn't afford it in the first place so there's no difference in revenue,) then go for it.
And, as a footnote, there's even a certain sad irony that this piracy may force production values back up if people ignore the worse media out there in favour of perusing the good media. To be realistic, no-one's really going to hike £80 to see an Anime series if they've never seen Anime, but if they download it, well then they're at least exposed to it. And if they see that it's good then they may buy it. People live in a world of crap, there are gems out there, people need to see them in order to get them.
someone i know *hint hint his name begins with RAB* pirates. he does it simply because he cannot afford cd's. all he pirates are songs. music industries are charging too much for music and left him no other choice. if there was a better alternative, he would indeed be willing to pay, but he cant.
I do believe that there is something to be said for the exorbaint price of certian programs. Specifically those found in the Adobe CS2 Suite.
I have a number of friends in my graphic desgin and animation classes, who need to have a copy of these programs (legitamate or not) becuase they will be studying animation and/or graphic design in college. But virtually none of them have the money need to pay for these programs (Illustrator, Photoshop, Dreamweaver, Maya, Bryce, Poser, ect...). And I do think that becuase Adobe has no equal compeditor in it's field, that they do price gouge.
President of Novistrana
19th January 2003
Prices of everything is inflated to achive maximum profit, they maxiumize it to the point where your still willing to pay, it's called price-gouging.
Piracy is the ying, over priced software is yang.
I wouldn't say they're price gouging when it comes to computer and video games. They're basically at the same price they've been at for years. $50 to $60 for new releases, $30 for 6 month old games that aren't blockbusters, $15 to $20 for older games.
President of Novistrana
19th January 2003
Sure software is, software is where the money is made especially in console software.