Race Subtleties And How Relic Fails To Deliver -1 reply

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#1 12 years ago

For those without a lot of time, SUMMARY: Relic's implications of strengths and weaknesses are subtle and hard to understand or utilize; Relic should at least make the tutorial a little more in depth. Relic claims to balance all the races; however they assume we will be able to "figure out" those strengths and weaknesses. Some are obvious, such as Eldar being great at anti-tank, yet Eldar are bad at melee. We don't know the subtleties of the Eldar; I personally believe Relic should give a more throrough tutorial defining how each race operates best, e.g. they say Build posessed marines and take down this building, rather than just leaving it to YOU to figure it out. Space Marines are excellent at defense and ranged combat. We can figure that much out by just skirmishing against a computer. However, the subtleties escape most of us: I can name one, i'm sure there are many others I missed. If you have two space marine squads, and 2 squads of Slugga Boyz are charging towards you, the Marine player would assume that the Boyz are both charging towards one squad. Then, they can move one squad to the Other Side of the orks (not attack move, but just move) so that the Orks are the ones tied up while the space marines engage in range. Even though that squad will probably be decimated, support has probably arrived by now. This is one of those subtleties Relic does not explain Another would lie in the Eldar. The early-game Ranger+Guardian trap is great. This one is slightly more obvious, yet Relic stll fails to explain the subtleties. You get a squad or two of rangers, and a bunch of guardians. You move to engage, for example, a listening post, with your rangers. You place your guardians behind your rangers in STAND GROUND stance, and then when enemy support arrives, they will most likely be guys without really long range weapons, so your Guardians can own those two cultist squads sent to kill (yes, 18-22 dmg owns 7-12) the rangers. And the enemy really has nothing to kill the guardians until tanks. I've named a few but are there are obviously more tactics, I'd really like to see this topic become a sticky... What, what? No, I didnt say anything, I swear!




mad_chipmunk

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#2 12 years ago

The tooltips you a reading are wrong. 99% of the time they are charging toword 1 squad. Eldar has a incredible melee with baneshees call of war. by the way 2 raptor squads would take down your guardian/ranger 1 berserker squad would take it down. one commander would take it down. Chaos heavy bolters would own the guardians. If this gets a sticky i will shit myself.




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#3 12 years ago

Argh, you don't get it. Just because Eldar have a melee specialist doesn't mean they're meant for melee. Oh, Space Marines have a couple melee specialists? Man, I gotta go all melee with SM! And I'd like to see a commander take 4 full guardian squads and 2 full ranger squads on alone. Alrght, brought a couple support squads? Own them first, the commander can only kill so many guys before your chaos marine squads are dead, as well as your chaos lord. And most likely, as stated in my first post, 2 raptor squads would most likely charge towards 1 squad and thus I think 3 guardian squads and 1 ranger squad can own two squads of raptors easily.

Also, please BACK up your posts - I don't see any real logic behind "Chaos heavy bolters would own the guardians." Wait, you mean the guardians which you'd have to come within ranger range (no wordplay intended) to shoot at? *high-pitched sniping noise* "Accept your weakness, and fall back!!!" And these are just a few examples, and just as in chess, no defense or attack is perfect.

The next person who posts had BETTER not be criticizing my ideas and instead should be CONTRIBUTING, thank you very much. Stay on topic!

Without further ado, I come with a new tactic discovered recently. It's really simple, yet not all people get it.

If you arrange your turrets and/or defenders in a wide-arc U formation, they stand the best chance of holding out against an attack. This assumes that the enemy will not be coming "around a corner" and that you're probably bottlenecking them. But if you get them in a U, your guys will shoot all at relatively similar times, helping if these weapons knock over or stun, so that your other weapons continue to pick off. _ / l * \ - * = the owned enemy

Another underused and underexploited tactic is putting Space Marines which are defending a location on roofs when fighting a close-combat favoring opponent. The only way they can get to you is jumppacks/teleportation, and you can hog the space on each roof so they try and jump with 5 Stormboy squads, and only 1 finds space. 2 or 3 SM squads will decimate one stormboy squad, case closed.

Without further ado, let me hear YOUR IDEAS (glares at mad_chipmunk)




mad_chipmunk

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#4 12 years ago

Rangers only break moral. My [COLOR=Red]IDEA. [COLOR=Black]Dont use rangers they are horrible units The logic behind chaos heavy bolters own guardians is......Even broken csm with heavy bolters will kill the guardians which is all rangers do. And what idiot is just going to send all raptors on 1 squad? Why not attack rangers with the slow moving and long setup times isnt it 65 req to reinforce?[/COLOR][/COLOR][COLOR=Red][COLOR=Black]How did i not stay on subject all you did was rant and i ranted about you ranting. Or they could just jump into the rangers with the raptors they would at least take a little casutlys because of your guardians that wont want to move. An [COLOR=Yellow][COLOR=Red]Idea [/COLOR][/COLOR][COLOR=Yellow][COLOR=Red][COLOR=Black]would be to use your 3 cultists squads to soak up the pitiful damage of the rangers well your raptors blow them away Or send in the cultist and the csm lord. How many guardians and rangers are you putting in one lord should destroy your front lines with the raptors. Or have the cultist engage and have them blow away with heavy bolters. Or as ork just send in about 30 guys and trounce you. Or as sm sit in your base and wait for bionics :P. Or as guard just own you with the commisonar immune moral/healing combo that will render the rangers moral damage useless. Or as another eldar use dark reapers (it might work i dont use eldar much) Every race exept sm has a incredible tier 2 infantry that would slaughter that entire army. Your "underused" space marines tactic has flaws. How many maps have a roof. Its all well and good but when the slugga squad gets mowed down why not take the extra 4 seconds and go to the base. Once again this is my [COLOR=Red]IDEA [COLOR=Black]To counter your idea. This has been my

Ideas to help![/COLOR][/COLOR][/COLOR][/COLOR][/COLOR][/COLOR][/COLOR]




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#5 12 years ago

I'm really pissed because I just typed a longwinded reply and it didn't go through. SOOOO....

I'll badly rewrite it and hope you make sense out of it.

Just because there are counters doesn't mean you can't counter the counters! Raptors on my ranger+guardian combo? Farseer hangs out. Commander? Warlock pulls an Entangle while the troops take a chunk out of his health.

Guys, please give me some good tactics so I may improve everyone's playing, (mostly my own, heh.)

What? No way am I being selfish, uh uh.




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#6 12 years ago

I typed a long winded reply to and you have failed to read more then 1% of it i leave this thread to die.




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#7 12 years ago

wow, um, I read it.

About the roof thing, it's like a comedian practicing his jokes - he doesn't use even half of his lines in a show, but they'll come in handy in another show. They're used at the right time in the right place and the right situation - they're not "rules of thumb."

So Chipmunk, I haven't really heard any of your tactics, just good counters to my ideas. Want to give it a shot?




mad_chipmunk

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#8 12 years ago

Ok Heres a guard strat

Put down infantry command, then build 3 guard squads to cap and 1 extra techpreist, make a generator, then the armoury thing, (name escapes me) then extra gen cap points, go tier 2, then get a machine command and build hellhounds its pretty fast if you do it right




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#9 12 years ago

yep that's pretty good,

With all due respect, it's kind of hard to understand, could you please phrase it so the rest of us can understand it?

Example:

1. Stuff 2. More stuff 3. Even more




mad_chipmunk

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#10 12 years ago

Ok get 3 guard squads cap some stuff Then get your infantry building Then make a generator cap your points with listioning posts. build another gen + tactica control after second point capped Then go tier 2 Get a mech command research hellhounds Enjoy Throw in some preists for that uber chainsaw ^_^